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Old 01-31-2018, 02:01 AM   #1
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EA: We Believe In Microtransactions when they are "done right."

We believe EA should be shut down.

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EA: We Believe In Microtransactions
After controversy around Star Wars: Battlefront 2, EA says it believes in microtransactions when they are "done right."


You should expect games from Electronic Arts to continue to offer "live service" components and optional microtransactions, the company said today. As part of its latest earnings report, EA CEO Andrew Wilson addressed the controversy surrounding Star Wars: Battlefront II's implementation of microtransactions before doubling down on letting investors know that microtransactions are here to stay.

"Going forward, we believe that live services that include optional digital monetization, when done right, provide a very important element of choice that can extend and enhance the experience in our games," Wilson said. "We're committed to continually working with our players to deliver the right experience in each of our games and live services."

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For Battlefront II specifically, Wilson said the game was "definitely a learning opportunity." EA decided to temporarily remove all microtransactions from the game due in part to the "sentiment and community data coming out of the beta and early trials." Microtransactions are coming back, scheduled to return "in the next few months." However, it remains to be seen how they may be changed. In their original form, players could buy loot boxes that contained game-affecting items with real money.

Just how big are microtransactions in terms of revenue for EA? For the latest quarter, EA's digital net bookings for "live services," which includes optional add-on content, came to $787 million. That represents year-over-year growth of 39 percent. Check out the chart above to get a closer look at the numbers.

Wilson went on to say he's happy that the Battlefront II community is so outspoken, acknowledging that EA did not get it right with how the game used microtransactions.

"We never intended to build an experience that could be seen as unfair or lacking clear progression, so we removed the feature that was taking away from what fans were telling us was an otherwise great game," Wilson said. "We are fortunate to have such passionate players that will tell us when we get it right, and when we don't. We're now working hard on more updates that will meet the needs of our players, and we hope to bring these to the Battlefront II community in the months ahead."

Wilson added that, while Battlefront II's initial shipments failed to reach EA's projections or match the first game's out-of-the-gate sales, the game is still enjoying a lot of success. "Fans spent twice as much time playing Battlefront II over the previous game during the launch quarter," Wilson said, adding that almost 70 percent of Battlefront II players tried the campaign.

He went on to say that "engagement" has been "strong" with Battlefront II's DLC so far. More content drops are coming in the months ahead, and Wilson said he thinks fans will "continue to have fantastic experiences over the long life of Battlefront II."

EA is of course not the only publisher whose games use microtransactions. Grand Theft Auto and Red Dead parent publisher Take-Two has said it wants to have some form of "recurrent consumer spending" in all of its games. Games from publishers like Ubisoft, Activision Blizzard, and Nintendo also use microtransactions in some form.


https://www.gamespot.com/articles/ea.../1100-6456456/
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Old 01-31-2018, 11:52 AM   #2
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Wich is never... because they never did it right.

Micro transaction models are inherantly scams. There is nothing good about them... but of course, scamming people is what EA likes to do best.
Quality and fun games?! What's that?! Too risky!

God i hope MS buys them. Then these ass face execs can be without a job.
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Old 02-01-2018, 02:03 AM   #3
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Micro transaction models are inherantly scams. There is nothing good about them...
I don't agree with this statement. But then again, I don't think anyone has really gotten micro transactions right.

But I think Overwatch is real close. All the items in the loot boxes are cosmetic. They basically say that the revenue from selling loot boxes funds all the future development of the game so that once you buy the base game, you don't have to pay for any of the future maps, modes, features, or heroes. Which is good, because multiplayer games die when you fracture the player base because one group can play Map A and one group can't (See: Titanfall).

And Overwatch today is a WAY better game with WAY more content than a year and a half ago when it released. And if you haven't paid a cent to Blizzard since you bought the game back in May 2016, you can play every new hero, map, or mode as someone who purchased loot boxes and you are not at a strategic disadvantage to them in any way.

However, the major complaint people have is that you can't buy of the loot box cosmetics directly, which I think is valid. Having said that, my gut tells me that if they DO allow people to buy things directly, it applies direct value to each and every item in the loot boxes. And when you can do that, then you can calculate the approximate value of an average single loot box. And then you have loot boxes actually being gambling because there is a monetary value to the items. I can say "Oh a loot box costs $X.XX, and I have a chance to 'win' up to $XX.XX" which is literally gambling. When the items can't be purchased, it's all relative and pointless speculation. They have no value because they can't be bought.

If people can propose a way for a game like Overwatch to continue development as it does today without micro transactions, email Blizzard because you just became a millionaire, congratulations.

[Edit] On a separate note, when Overwatch was getting shit on because of EA's shitty versions of loot boxes, I thought people were stroking their rage boners way too hard, hard enough to set their dicks on fire.

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Old 02-03-2018, 04:20 AM   #4
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The thing is Overwatch is a fully priced game.

Like, theres 2 issues here. The game released at launch and the service.

The game at lauch that is asking full price HAS to be a full package. It can't have micro-transaction on top and pieces of the game witheld to sell in boxes.

The service is a different thing and has to be separate. I personally prefer a sub model where you get everything there is to offer than random lootboxes that just mean that you will have to pay more than a sub to get everything. Literally, to get what you used to get, you will have to gamble and pay more than ever. It is therefore a scam aswell.

If it's a free to play game, then i can still see that the game is just based in the service and that is alright, because at least they were honest since the start on what they were and people can make a choice. But a premium game with micro-transactions is simply a clear scam.
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Old 02-03-2018, 10:21 AM   #5
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But a premium game with micro-transactions is simply a clear scam.
LOL, you keep saying that...but I've already said that everything in the loot boxes are completely optional and have no bearing on the gameplay whatsoever. If you want skins, emotes, voice lines...then buy lootboxes. Make your own 'subscription fee' by paying for lootboxes then. If you just want to play Overwatch, you don't need to pay for anything further past the base purchase.

I literally have no idea how you think your argument is legitimate. The game is a scam? Let's look at your argument:

Quote:
The game at lauch that is asking full price HAS to be a full package
Literally everyone who paid for Overwatch at launch has gotten MORE than what they paid for, regardless if they bought loot boxes or not. If you bought the game at launch, here's the additional content you received past the original experience:

5 New Characters
5 New Maps
5 New Gameplay modes (many of which comes with their own, new, maps)
The Overwatch Arcade
Replay Manager
Server Browser
Seasonal Events, about 6 a year (that come with their own new gameplay modes like Lucioball, Capture the Flag, and Junkenstein's Revenge)

In a 20 month period. For. Free.

Literally your argument is that despite all the free gameplay content that has been given to people who purchased Overwatch, the fact that cosmetic items that don't affect gameplay whatsoever, irks you....because you'd rather pay a monthly fee (lol) just so you can have all the skins, emotes, voice lines, et cetera.

I guarantee most people like having the option of, well, not paying a monthly fee for this game and rather just play for the gameplay and not cosmetic bullshit. But if you wanna throw your money away with a monthly fee...just keep buying lootboxes. Hell, I've spent $40 on lootboxes for the main game (not season) stuff since May 2016 and I have around 90% of the cosmetic stuff from getting lootboxes from playing the game.

Quote:
I personally prefer a sub model where you get everything there is to offer
Seriously, you'd pay a monthly fee for skins, voice lines, and emotes? I mean, it's your money...but it seems like publishers don't need to really twist your arm to take it.
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Old 02-03-2018, 12:09 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Drunken Savior View Post
LOL, you keep saying that...but I've already said that everything in the loot boxes are completely optional and have no bearing on the gameplay whatsoever. If you want skins, emotes, voice lines...then buy lootboxes. Make your own 'subscription fee' by paying for lootboxes then. If you just want to play Overwatch, you don't need to pay for anything further past the base purchase.

I literally have no idea how you think your argument is legitimate. The game is a scam? Let's look at your argument:

Literally everyone who paid for Overwatch at launch has gotten MORE than what they paid for, regardless if they bought loot boxes or not. If you bought the game at launch, here's the additional content you received past the original experience:

5 New Characters
5 New Maps
5 New Gameplay modes (many of which comes with their own, new, maps)
The Overwatch Arcade
Replay Manager
Server Browser
Seasonal Events, about 6 a year (that come with their own new gameplay modes like Lucioball, Capture the Flag, and Junkenstein's Revenge)

In a 20 month period. For. Free.

Literally your argument is that despite all the free gameplay content that has been given to people who purchased Overwatch, the fact that cosmetic items that don't affect gameplay whatsoever, irks you....because you'd rather pay a monthly fee (lol) just so you can have all the skins, emotes, voice lines, et cetera.

I guarantee most people like having the option of, well, not paying a monthly fee for this game and rather just play for the gameplay and not cosmetic bullshit. But if you wanna throw your money away with a monthly fee...just keep buying lootboxes. Hell, I've spent $40 on lootboxes for the main game (not season) stuff since May 2016 and I have around 90% of the cosmetic stuff from getting lootboxes from playing the game.

Seriously, you'd pay a monthly fee for skins, voice lines, and emotes? I mean, it's your money...but it seems like publishers don't need to really twist your arm to take it.

Ok. Point 1. The optional stuff, like voice samples, outfits, secret levels. They were all in the disc, day one. Now, you seem to think these things are bonuses to pay for? They got literally ripped out of the games to be sold as micro-transactions.

Point 2. Overwatch was not a complete game at launch. It's a multiplayer only team based game with limited content. People who bought it basically bought a beta. It was literally half a game. Blizzard gave you some goodies for "free". Aren't you lucky?
They give that stuff cause they want you to keep the game active, not due to the kindness of their hearts.


In conclusion: products are products and services are services. Trying to sell a product and then shoving it in as a service is not something i apreciate, and it is a scam/dishonest.
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Old 02-03-2018, 01:57 PM   #7
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You get loot boxes for playing the game. I've gotten probably a thousand without having to pay anything. You can get everything by just buying the base game. Hardly seems like a burden since we keep getting new content.
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Old 02-03-2018, 07:44 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by BlindMaphisto
You get loot boxes for playing the game. I've gotten probably a thousand without having to pay anything. You can get everything by just buying the base game. Hardly seems like a burden since we keep getting new content.
And I've gotten around 80% of it all by just playing the game. Since I play arcade most of the time, I actually get a ridiculous amount of loot boxes. But to be fair, I really don't care about it much anymore. If I see something cool, I get it with all the gold I've saved up. Right now, all I care about is playing the game.

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The optional stuff, like voice samples, outfits, secret levels. They were all in the disc, day one.
LOL What? All the shit they developed AFTER LAUNCH was on the disc the entire time? Really? All the stuff developed from May 2016-today was already on the disc? Fucking time lords with their scam ass game! Put the liquor down, man. It's obvious that you have no idea what you're arguing about...

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Blizzard gave you some goodies for "free". Aren't you lucky? They give that stuff cause they want you to keep the game active, not due to the kindness of their hearts.
LOL, Jesus man...I already said that funding for all this post development was made possible by people who wanted to buy loot boxes. The whole argument of "wow. don't you realize publishers aren't your friend!?" woke shit is passe. Also, I'm still not the one who would pay a monthly fee for this game, lol.

And some 'goodies'? People didn't get cosmetic shit for free, they got additional gameplay for free!

But keep grasping at straws at this weak ass argument.
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Old 02-06-2018, 07:09 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by Drunken Savior View Post
And I've gotten around 80% of it all by just playing the game. Since I play arcade most of the time, I actually get a ridiculous amount of loot boxes. But to be fair, I really don't care about it much anymore. If I see something cool, I get it with all the gold I've saved up. Right now, all I care about is playing the game.



LOL What? All the shit they developed AFTER LAUNCH was on the disc the entire time? Really? All the stuff developed from May 2016-today was already on the disc? Fucking time lords with their scam ass game! Put the liquor down, man. It's obvious that you have no idea what you're arguing about...



LOL, Jesus man...I already said that funding for all this post development was made possible by people who wanted to buy loot boxes. The whole argument of "wow. don't you realize publishers aren't your friend!?" woke shit is passe. Also, I'm still not the one who would pay a monthly fee for this game, lol.

And some 'goodies'? People didn't get cosmetic shit for free, they got additional gameplay for free!

But keep grasping at straws at this weak ass argument.
Obviously, i was talking about how things used to be made. Some of the content developed for Overwatch before launch was taken out to be part of the loot boxes. That wasn't something that used to happen.

I am still surprised how you are so open to what is essentially a full price F2P game. My mind is blown by that.

But, well... i guess we have different views on this.
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Old 02-06-2018, 02:17 PM   #10
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I am still surprised how you are so open to what is essentially a full price F2P game. My mind is blown by that.
Why on Earth would you think it should be Free to Play?

If F2P games were at the same level of quality as Overwatch, the F2P tag wouldn't have such negative connotations. But they aren't, so it does.

If your mind is blown, then you are really out of touch on why the game is popular and what people loathe about the F2P model, even on F2P games with good mechanics.
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Old 02-06-2018, 03:09 PM   #11
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Micro transaction models are inherantly scams. There is nothing good about them....
Beat me to it!
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Old 02-06-2018, 08:11 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Drunken Savior View Post
Why on Earth would you think it should be Free to Play?

If F2P games were at the same level of quality as Overwatch, the F2P tag wouldn't have such negative connotations. But they aren't, so it does.

If your mind is blown, then you are really out of touch on why the game is popular and what people loathe about the F2P model, even on F2P games with good mechanics.

I think that is a Stigma you got. For example, Heroes of the storm from blizzard is free and has the same level of quality and content support.
The lootbox model IS an F2P model. Every F2P mobile game has it. Wich is why it's scandalous to put it on top of a fully priced game.

You can't have both buddy. It's either a product or a service. Trying to stack both is greedy and i know you don't like to hear it, but it's a scam.
I also don't think that because i don't let myself be scammed i am somehow "out of touch" with the market.
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Old 02-06-2018, 09:30 PM   #13
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For example, Heroes of the storm from blizzard is free and has the same level of quality and content support.
Heroes of the Storm doesn't let you have the whole roster of characters from the start. You have to pay for them or earn them through loot boxes. That's why there's no upfront cost for HOTS, because you have to pay to unlock gameplay...or spend hundreds of hours playing it to unlock all the gameplay.

Overwatch lets you have access to the entire swath of gameplay from the start. All the heros, all the maps, all the modes. Past and future gameplay.

Not the same. And that's not even getting into the fact that Overwatch and Heroes of the Storm aren't even the same type of game. The only similarity is that they both have characters with specific skill sets. But comparing the two games would be like saying that Counterstrike is like League of Legends.

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I also don't think that because i don't let myself be scammed i am somehow "out of touch" with the market.
No, it's because you obviously don't know why one game is F2P and one game isn't. It's not rocket science. If Overwatch was a full price game and then made you unlock/pay for gameplay then yes, I'd agree with you.

But that isn't the case. And I've been saying that for days now. You can't claim to be woke on a topic and yet not even know the games you're discussing.
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Old 02-07-2018, 04:56 AM   #14
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Heroes of the Storm doesn't let you have the whole roster of characters from the start. You have to pay for them or earn them through loot boxes. That's why there's no upfront cost for HOTS, because you have to pay to unlock gameplay...or spend hundreds of hours playing it to unlock all the gameplay.

Overwatch lets you have access to the entire swath of gameplay from the start. All the heros, all the maps, all the modes. Past and future gameplay.

Not the same. And that's not even getting into the fact that Overwatch and Heroes of the Storm aren't even the same type of game. The only similarity is that they both have characters with specific skill sets. But comparing the two games would be like saying that Counterstrike is like League of Legends.



No, it's because you obviously don't know why one game is F2P and one game isn't. It's not rocket science. If Overwatch was a full price game and then made you unlock/pay for gameplay then yes, I'd agree with you.

But that isn't the case. And I've been saying that for days now. You can't claim to be woke on a topic and yet not even know the games you're discussing.
How on earth is it different? How many heroes does overwatch give you acess to and how many does HotS? I bet heroes still has more. Yet, you payed 60 bucks for overwatch's.
I don't see why genre matters at all as a distinction. Both are short duration team based multiplayer games. Btw... heroes gives you a free 30 heroes at the start, added to the rotation ones.

I am also wide awake, wich is why i don't think these practices are ok in full price games. This hasn't even touched on the fact that loot boxes are unregulated gambling. Are you though? Your acceptance of such practices seems to come out of lazyness. The logic that you put some money down, you get the game and extra content. But the box price is them taking advantage of you. It is not the model that keeps the game going and it wasn't a package worth 60 bucks. It didn't even have a campaign.


Btw Drunken, i like you and i don't want this to weird things out. Just saying this cause the discussion is being heated and i don't want it to ruin the vibes of the forum. At the end of the day, it's ok to disagree.
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Old 02-07-2018, 06:09 AM   #15
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How on earth is it different? How many heroes does overwatch give you acess to and how many does HotS? I bet heroes still has more. Yet, you payed 60 bucks for overwatch's.
I don't see why genre matters at all as a distinction. Both are short duration team based multiplayer games. Btw... heroes gives you a free 30 heroes at the start, added to the rotation ones.
Overwatch on PC is $40, because you don't have to pay Sony/Microsoft licensing fees or ship physical media (which is irrelevant in an online game anyways).

And it's different because Overwatch adds a layer of strategy by allowing you to switch heroes mid-game in order to apply different strategies. If you don't have access to the full roster from the start, then you are at a serious disadvantage to your opponents who do have access to those heroes. If you had an advantage over your opponents because you could swap, it'd literally be pay-to-win.

HOTS immediately turned me off when I first tried it and wanted to try out a different character that wasn't on rotation. Luckily, I had the in-game currency given to me to buy her to try her in some live matches, but it quickly became apparent that I didn't want to play a game that forces me to pay for characters or pigeon holes me into playing only characters on rotation.

The problem I have with your argument (which is similar to other critics like Angry Joe and Jim Sterling) is that it's rooted in principle and not specifics and actual real life practice. It tries to take a very complex subject and make it black and white, whereas I see shades of gray. I've detailed specifics, cited examples, and all I've gotten back from you was incorrect examples (comparing HOTS to Overwatch in regards to available gameplay from the start) or a lack of understanding of the subjects you're arguing about (like suggesting that Overwatch shipped with content on the disc that was actually developed post-launch).

I still say lootboxes that contain cosmetic items that do not affect gameplay as a means to support post-launch content is perfectly fine and Blizzard has been upfront with their economic model from the start (even when they were still figuring it all out). The development of the game in the last 20 months has been very good and very substaintial. There's a clear customer-producer relationship and I know that I can't get something for free, so post-development cost has to come from somewhere. Before, we just shrugged off post-development in games and waited for a sequel after the coffers dry out from initial purchases to update the base game's content. Given Blizzard's history, I doubt we'll be seeing Overwatch 2 for many, many years. Hell, it took 12 years for Starcraft to get a sequel. I bet we'll see EA's Battlefront 3, 4, and 5 before we see Overwatch 2. And that's a good thing.

You just wanna say "...a premium game with micro-transactions is simply a clear scam." Which is a wholly naive statement and misses the point of why loot boxes are a hot topic now. The reason why people's hate boners are at full mast is because of the new Middle Earth: Shadow of War and Battlefront 2 games and how they utilize loot boxes. Both games LOCK literal gameplay behind a paywall. Middle Earth with runes (character enhancements) as well as orcs, and Battlefront with heroes (like Darth Vader). This was a clear and obvious negative impact on how the gameplay functions mechanically. That is in clear contrast to how Blizzard chose to use loot boxes in 2016 and why everyone's panties didn't get soiled over loot boxes 20 months ago.

And again, I'll state that I don't think Blizzard is perfect with their use. Like I said earlier, they should allow for a more direct way to allow people to buy a particular cosmetic item instead of buying loot boxes. But I know that in-doing so, it opens up large avenues for abuse and the last thing that Blizzard wants is for Overwatch to be entangled in a CSGO-like gambling scandal...especially when they have Hearthstone's Pay 2 Win model going absolutely bonkers right now. They also shouldn't make the limited event legendary skins cost 3000 gold when a regular season skin cost is 1000. So yeah, not perfect, but certainly nowhere near as egregious as what WB and EA did with their implementation of loot boxes.

Right now, Overwatch's loot boxes are just a fun way of expressing yourself and offer no real impact on the game. And if people want to buy that content, then let them. Personal responsibility and consumer responsibility, at some point, has to be mentioned in this discussion. It's insufferable when people try to act like they hold no accountability. But Blizzard is taking the revenue from loot boxes and using it to give additional content to the entire fanbase...and not just 'goodies' like you facetiously mentioned earlier...actual additional gameplay content to everyone who plays. The battlefield is always even and level (unlike F2P games) and player bases don't get fractured (like what happened when Titanfall 1 made DLC maps).

Is there a better way to fund post-launch games? Maybe, but like I said...if you know of a way that the public will like, get off Magic Box and go tell Blizzard and collect your millions.
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