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View Full Version : Are you still using Kazaa?


Vyse
06-27-2003, 07:05 PM
I'm just wondering, because I've been at my dads, and my computers at my moms so I havnt been using it, but I guess after the announcements alot of people stopped, I doubt if they would randomly target me, when I dont even download that many songs, but I'm just wondeirng how everyone else is feeling about it.

insteefy
06-27-2003, 08:35 PM
no

Kid0_oIcarus
06-27-2003, 11:50 PM
what is this kaa..zaa you speak of?

Kojiro Hyuga
06-28-2003, 03:27 AM
What are you talking about? I have Kazzaa and dont know whats going on!

Seska
06-28-2003, 03:29 AM
The RIAA cecently announced that it was going to systematically target all users that downloaded massive amounts of music and shared massive amounts of music through P2P programs.

'course, god knows what their definition of "Massive" is. I've stopped using Kazaa and eMule ever since the dawn of BT. I jsut use KAzaa when theres a specific song I can't find on Newsgroups.

Vyse
06-28-2003, 01:22 PM
From what I heard on the radio, they are mainly targeting people that people are UPLOADING songs from, so maybe if I make it so mine cant be shared....I have like 600 Kazaa files...but I doubt thats massive, they will probably go for people titled Guru

insteefy
06-29-2003, 07:15 PM
yea, i heard that if they would catch u, they would blow up ur comp or wtf?!?!

touch my comp, and it will be the last thing u will touch in a very very long time....

besides, within a month or so, they will have a new anti-targeting kazaa and what not..


pssssshhhhhht

megajo53
06-29-2003, 08:20 PM
Originally posted by Seska
The RIAA cecently announced that it was going to systematically target all users that downloaded massive amounts of music and shared massive amounts of music through P2P programs.

'course, god knows what their definition of "Massive" is. I've stopped using Kazaa and eMule ever since the dawn of BT. I jsut use KAzaa when theres a specific song I can't find on Newsgroups.

They are only targeting those that upload copyrighted music. Downloading isn't illegal, its sharing them thats against the law.

Vyse
06-30-2003, 12:42 AM
ahhh...excellent, so I can just make it not share and then they will hit the morons who dont stop????

Are TV shows legal to share? I download alot of those, and feel like I should give SOMETHING back...Im kind of in a quandry about feeding off of someone elses risks.

Icarus4578
07-17-2003, 10:25 AM
It's all 100% bullsh*t. The record industry is just pissy because they go and give 'artists' like Mariah Carey 80 million dollar contracts that they'll never recover from (at least through that one person) and release a bunch of crap nobody wants to buy. So since they aren't pulling in enough money from the crap that is out there in the mass media they blame it on file-sharing, which actually has helped boost the sales of many artists people otherwise wouldn't know about.

Now think about something; out of the money they make off of a record, they give like 5-10% of to the artists. To manufacture the albums must cost them a penny for an album or two. How would I know? Think about something; you walk into Circuit City or wherever, and you buy a 100 CD-R(W) set for $15-20. That's .20 cents or so per disc you're paying. The store buys it in mass quantities, meaning they pay alot less than you do for each stack (about $2-3 a stack). So it costs them about .4 cents per CD. Now, a record company that manufactures CDs in mass quantities buys them in massive beyond scope quantities. It must cost them about ONE CENT for one CD, maybe even two. All total, to manufacture an entire CD w/ jewelcasing and booklet, must put them back a measly .4-5 cents per disc. So, yeah, believe me, they make alot more than they spend on manufacturing the products and distributing them. They're just full of sh*t, that's all. And oh yeah, all that merchandising and the live sales don't hurt either.

The reason losers like Metallica blame lack of sales on file-sharing over the internet is because they're just crybabies that need an excuse other than the fact that albums like Load/Reload suck ass. Do you know how many counter-lawsuits are going to be issued by people against the record companies for illegally invading their privacy and property? The record industry is gonna get their asses whipped. Oh, and if file-sharing is at fault for less record sales (it isn't), then explain how come back before the internet they'd play singles and such over the radio and on TV and you could record them, and yet that didn't stop people from buying the albums/singles. After all, isn't recording a song over the radio 'file-sharing'? What about all the bootlegs and stuff? What about all the people copying albums for other people?

Drunken Savior
07-17-2003, 05:36 PM
Ehh...BT took a major hit yesterday.... http://www.torrentse.cx/ shut down because an artist known as "BT" (The Irony is so thick) had his record label email them webmaster a "cease and disist" email threatening legal action for the financial damages he/she has recieved by his/her album being downloaded for free.

Macs don't use Kazaa, it' good ol Hotline/BitTorrent/Limewire for me.

Zod
07-17-2003, 06:01 PM
Used it two years ago to get por.........uh.........video game previews. Had it for about a month, in which time my computer got the blue screen of death as well as freezes multiple times daily. Investigating, I found 83 pieces of spyware on my computer, including one so bad it destroyed the internet explorer socket and replaced it with it's own to make sure I can't get rid of it so easily.I did get rid of it, and Kazaa too. when I did, my comp stopped acting up all the time. Now I stay on top of scanning for spyware and avoid Kazaa like the red-headed death angel.


The RIAA is ran by fascist nazis making all the wrong kinds of mistakes with their blatant attacks on people they want as customers. Each and every time they pull something, they probably only encourage more music stealing than deter.
The reason losers like Metallica blame lack of sales on file-sharing over the internet is because they're just crybabies that need an excuse other than the fact that albums like Load/Reload suck ass.

I agree. When bands failed to meet expectations of fans in the past and their sales tanked, they were called has-beens and gracefully stepped aside. Metallica, especially that obnoxious pr*ck drummer, thinks they can just attack people instead of doing so, and blaming their own fans for not buying music that sucks in comparison to what they used to do.

Smart way to p*ss off the RIAA: burn your stuff to discs! That way, they're no 10,000 songs on your HD.


What sucks the most about Kazaa: trying to find a game preview or anime and finding a billion fan-made music videos instead. God that sucks and gets annoying fast. No I don't give a sh*t to hear Limp Bizkit's songs mixed to Sailor Moon clips, so for the love of God please stop that!!

Drunken Savior
07-17-2003, 06:38 PM
Hey now, I made a AMV of the Rolling Stones "Gimme Shelter" to Cowboy Bebop that I thought was mighty decent. If I can find a BT site that doesn't crap out and lets the public UL..I'll put it up.

And don't use Kazaa, use Kazaa Lite.

Cobi*
07-17-2003, 09:35 PM
Originally posted by Vyse
From what I heard on the radio, they are mainly targeting people that people are UPLOADING songs from, so maybe if I make it so mine cant be shared....I have like 600 Kazaa files...but I doubt thats massive, they will probably go for people titled Guru

heh, if everyone stops uploading then p2p is essentially dead.


the problem i have with the situation is what is the definition of a "guru" user? (how many files?) and what happens if, the RIAA threatens you, and you delete your files or remove them from your computer? (do they still have a case if there is no evidence?)

i have noticed a decline in the number of users uploading songs on winMX (the one i use). it's not really as concerning as i thought it would be; i'll wait it out and see what happens before i start to panic.

i'm off and on with file sharing. there'll be a week in which i download and upload alot but, overall i wouldn't consider myself a big user of such services. besides ever since i discovered bittorrent i haven't been as interested in services like winMX and kazaa lite as i once was.

Icarus4578
07-18-2003, 09:07 AM
What, praytell, is 'Bittorrent'?

mackensie
07-18-2003, 09:18 AM
Originally posted by Icarus4578
What, praytell, is 'Bittorrent'?
http://www.google.com is your friend. ;)

Icarus4578
07-18-2003, 09:21 AM
Yeah, but what about http://www.moviewavs.com/javalist.shtml ?

Icarus4578
07-18-2003, 09:23 AM
Oh, and I would'nt be suprised if BitTorrent is just an easier way for the RIAA and others to invade the privacy of your computer.

mackensie
07-18-2003, 09:32 AM
Originally posted by Icarus4578
Oh, and I would'nt be suprised if BitTorrent is just an easier way for the RIAA and others to invade the privacy of your computer.
um, you mean an easier way to download extremely popular files, which normally swamp the download servers, and so people don't have to wait in line at places like www.fileplanet.com.

You clearly don't understand the point of bittorrent.

Icarus4578
07-18-2003, 09:34 AM
No, I understand it perfectly. Instead of one host having to handle all the downloads, people upload from each other's computers. Am I correct? But it still uses a main server nonetheless, so it's not much different; it just means it is easier to get a clean, fast download.

Danchastu
07-18-2003, 09:51 AM
Use BT for new anime and Kazaa Lite for everything else.

Icarus4578
07-18-2003, 09:53 AM
Or better yet, buy the actual thing at a store or online like you should. The only thing I really agree with is downloading music because much of it is stuff you discover and that oughta make you want to purchase the artists you enjoyed listening to. Cartoons, movies, etc. I dunno, but then again, how can I complain? After all, VCRs and DVD-RWs were invented for a reason.

mackensie
07-18-2003, 09:56 AM
it has no connection to the RIAA or MPAA, and it much easier to shutdown than kazaa (as there is only one tracker file). And it has nothing to do with the "privacy of your computer".
Bittorrent in the future will be simular to http, ftp, smtp, irc, etc. Yes you can do illegal things on it, but the biggest pluses are the legal uses... i.e. the free RTCW game came out on bittorrent, and i was getting 3 times the download speed when compared to the ftp server. ditto with recient HL videos. It is a major plus for people who cannot afford bandwidth, but need to distribute large files.

Icarus4578
07-18-2003, 09:58 AM
I never used Kazaa; it is pure spyware, and that is supposed to be illegal. I have WinMX, but haven't used it in quite awhile because i've got so much music it HURTS.

mackensie
07-18-2003, 10:00 AM
kazaa lite takes out the spyware.
spyware is not illegal, as you agree to the spyware in the licence agreement in the kazaa install.
kazaa is not illegal, but the majority of the people who use it do do illegal things on it. Like a knife or gun, there are illegal uses, and legal uses.

Icarus4578
07-18-2003, 10:03 AM
But there exists the same chance online of doing something illegal as doing something out in the real world.

There's several things I need to get on CD; the Statue of Liberty song in Shadow Dancer, some songs from Cosmic Carnage, etc.

mackensie
07-18-2003, 10:29 AM
Originally posted by Icarus4578
But there exists the same chance online of doing something illegal as doing something out in the real world.

... and?

Icarus4578
07-18-2003, 10:34 AM
and that was just the point. You brought up the fact that people use the internet for illegal purposes and I simply said that there's nothing different going on in internet-land than in real life. Good and bad people exist everywhere.

Kazaa actually didn't warn people at first about the spyware. It was only after they were xposed that they began including the info in the License Terms and Agreement thing that appears before you install it. I'll never knowingly put spyware on my PC, which I keep ultra clean because I take virtually everything off of it that i'm not using.

mackensie
07-18-2003, 10:43 AM
Originally posted by Icarus4578
and that was just the point. You brought up the fact that people use the internet for illegal purposes and I simply said that there's nothing different going on in internet-land than in real life. Good and bad people exist everywhere.
well whatever you say, but " I never used Kazaa; it is pure spyware, and that is supposed to be illegal. " is false.
Originally posted by Icarus4578

Kazaa actually didn't warn people at first about the spyware. It was only after they were xposed that they began including the info in the License Terms and Agreement thing that appears before you install it. I'll never knowingly put spyware on my PC, which I keep ultra clean because I take virtually everything off of it that i'm not using.
There was information in the original license terms and agreement, but it was obfusticated. the community outcry was that it wasn't clear enough.

Icarus4578
07-18-2003, 10:45 AM
That's the entire point. And regardless of whether or not they tell you about the spyware, all spying is nothing more than 'invasion of privacy' and should be avoided altogether (illegal).

mackensie
07-18-2003, 10:57 AM
Originally posted by Icarus4578
That's the entire point. And regardless of whether or not they tell you about the spyware, all spying is nothing more than 'invasion of privacy' and should be avoided altogether (illegal).
Anonymous "spying" is not an invasion of privacy, and it can dramatically improve services. Also "spying" is not inheriantly evil, as it also can be used for benefitial marketing techniques.

The internet is a public place, and you have very little expectation of privacy in a public place. Just as if you are walking around outside, people can see you and follow what you are doing, it is even easier online with an ip address attached to your actions.

That said, I do not use products that are not anonymous, if they log my activity (except for ISP's, as they all are required to log). Spyware, Kazaa, and you agreeing to the loss of your privacy (by agreeing to the product licence) are all fully legal.

Icarus4578
07-18-2003, 11:03 AM
Ok. I take it from what you're saying you like the fact that pop-up appears everywhere, that companies can buy/sell your personal information and habits, and that ISPs shouldn't be a private affair.

mackensie
07-18-2003, 11:14 AM
ISP's are legally obligated to log customers, so if there are abuses, they can shut it down.

And I never claimed liking spyware and adware, infact I mentioned in the last part that I never use them.

You claimed that they were illegal, which is false. period.

Icarus4578
07-18-2003, 11:35 AM
My claim is that it is supposed to be illegal, but it isn't. They claim that the internet is a public domain; it is. But that doesn't mean your personal computer should be included as part of that domain. Isn't it YOUR property, after all? Spyware SHOULD be illegal. The name says it all.

Drunken Savior
07-18-2003, 02:20 PM
Nah, I use Bit Torrent to send my work to friends and professors all the time. Until I get a larger space to serve, I can keep bit torrent open and let people download short videos from me at will for weeks. It's kinda a cheap way of serving. Of course, I do have other uses for bit torrent.

I donno internet law, but I don't like spyware. I don't like spyware so much that I wouldn't use a program filled with it unless I had to. Another thing is that there are very few laws that protect people's privacy when it is not in regards to their financial savings or sicknesses. (i.e. patients bill of rights)

I have enough problems with cookies...

Zod
07-18-2003, 05:28 PM
Also "spying" is not inheriantly evil, as it also can be used for benefitial marketing techniques.

........just so they can send out even more unsolicited junk mail, and unsolicited harassment is illegal. Also, through spyware, it's not like they aquire information through honest means; they sought to collect it without yout knowledge or consent, then bombard you with ads you never asked for.


The internet is a public place, and you have very little expectation of privacy in a public place.

True, but spyware and adware go into your computer. That is not public domain, and is your private property they're breaking into without your permission.

There was information in the original license terms and agreement, but it was obfusticated. the community outcry was that it wasn't clear enough.

Like the average novice PC user will know what "we'll share your information with others" really means, and that it really means "difficult-to-get-rid-of programs hidden in Kazaa that in turn hide themselves on your PC for the sake of acting like a bug that reports back all your activity (even activity on secure servers that they have no business looking at, like school records, transactions with online banks, social security numbers, etc.) to any business looking to send out junk mail to harass the crap out of you to buy stuff."


Also, spyware doesn't just load through Kazaa; that's just the most obvious way. It also comes in hidden behind ads. This site has trying to autop-load Gator onto my PC without my permission, but my firewall stopped it. It originated from a pop-up that came up on this site.


Click on "view" then click on privacy report. You'll see that Gator or some other spyware company is here spying right now through the ads. I didn't download Kazaa to get them watching me, and didn't give them my permission, either. They're doing it anyway, and using the ad as a front.

Icarus4578
07-19-2003, 03:23 AM
If you put SpyWare on your computer, you may as well put a camera in your house, focus it on your computer screen, and feed the signal to those *******s that use the technology. You wanna know why? Because SpyWare doesn't simply track your online habits; it tracks EVERYTHING YOU DO ON YOUR COMPUTER, AT ANY TIME. That should be ILLEGAL, end of story.

This computer is MY PROPERTY, NOBODY ELSE'S!

Seska
07-19-2003, 03:50 AM
The moment you click "Ok" on the dialog box with the legal disclaimer on Kazaa, you are giving up all your rights and allowing them to spy on you.

So, it aint illegal, period. Its about as illegal as you sigining a contract for a house without reading it, and finding out you signed to buy a bungalow shack for 100 million bucks instead of a penthouse for 1. ITs your own fault for sigining up to something without checking it out first. :p

Plus hey, get Kazaa lite if you dont like spyware.

Icarus4578
07-19-2003, 04:27 AM
Don't you get it? SpyWare should be illegal because most people wouldn't knowingly put this crap into their computer. If you asked anybody whether or not they wanted SpyWare on their computer's hard drive, what do you think their answer would be? I think it's obvious. It is an invasion of privacy (no matter what you say) and should be illegal, period. Fortunately, I never downloaded Kazaa and never will, and I have so many programs which prevent SpyWare and other snooping devices it's insane.

Zod
07-19-2003, 08:17 AM
Originally posted by Seska
The moment you click "Ok" on the dialog box with the legal disclaimer on Kazaa, you are giving up all your rights and allowing them to spy on you.

So, it aint illegal, period. Its about as illegal as you sigining a contract for a house without reading it, and finding out you signed to buy a bungalow shack for 100 million bucks instead of a penthouse for 1. ITs your own fault for sigining up to something without checking it out first. :p

Plus hey, get Kazaa lite if you dont like spyware.


It's illegal if they word it in a way in which it doesn't state clearly exactly what thy intend to do and exactly how they intend to do it.

Seska
07-19-2003, 10:06 AM
As long as the disclaimer states, even in technical jargon, that the program will analyze information flow on your PC, spyware IS legal, like it or not. I certainly dont like it, but until Judicial assmunches clamp down on companies using spyware, its a legal though ethically questionable thing to do.

Sure, icarus, it SHOULD be illegal. It also should be illegal for the RIAA to issue subpoenas to users who in the privacy of their own home have shared maybe only 1 or 2 files on a P2P network (http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/31833.html). It also should be illegal for women who get raped in Nigeria to get sentenced to be stoned to death for adultery.

Add spyware onto the long, long list. Honestly, for me, its one of the lesser evils to get annoyed about on this world.

Icarus4578
07-19-2003, 10:09 AM
Well in my case, none of these things are acceptable. this conversation has gone as far as it could. We've both made our points.

Zod
07-19-2003, 10:35 AM
Originally posted by Seska
As long as the disclaimer states, even in technical jargon, that the program will analyze information flow on your PC, spyware IS legal, like it or not. I certainly dont like it, but until Judicial assmunches clamp down on companies using spyware, its a legal though ethically questionable thing to do.




That is wrong. I took a couple of semesters of business law in college, and one key thing is that you have to understand the contract, and it has to be clear enough for the average rational person to do so. Ambiguous ones hold about as much legal water as the titanic because of the room for manipulation.

Users who download Kazaa are only powerless because their complaint to the DA of "I was illegally downloading a copy of Terminator 3 when I realized I was being spied on by a program added by the P2P" won't exactly get you out of trouble. In other words, spyware through Kazaa is like dealing with the mob. You can't turn them in because you haven't been acting legally either, so they got you where they want you. Spyware that's brought in through other means, like the kind that auto-load themselves through pop-up ads, are easily prosecutable since you never did anything illegal to get into that situation.

Seska
07-20-2003, 12:23 PM
So please, pray tell, why isnt Gator being sued? Surely in a sue-happy country like the US, we should be seeing more legal action agaisnt the likes of Gator than a whole season's worth of Law and Order? Why hasn't Bonzi Buddy been chucked into the big house by now?

Also, it may be interesting to note that KAzaa is actually spyware free, though it does come plagued with adware, which though different is just as annoying.

Nindalf
07-20-2003, 12:34 PM
Little bit off topic, but what else can you expect from me, but what does "pray" mean? i have heard that in many sentences but i dont know what it means.

And no, im not using kazaa, never have and never will.

Alucard
07-20-2003, 12:51 PM
'pray tell' is just another form os saying 'please tell me' when you dont believe something and sort of demand an answer. Its just a term people use now and then. Nothing really important. Unles I dont know some history here..

And Icarus, this is a little late in the discussion, but back with your little reply on downloaded anime should be bought from shops and stuff. The anime that pops up on it is things that have just been aired on TV in japan and subbed by fans. The instant any of these shows get licensed by some company, they are removed from the places hosting them. The anime subbing community is pretty decent when it comes to the law.

Icarus4578
07-20-2003, 03:16 PM
That's why if you read, I second-guessed myself. :2happy: I have some subbed stuff (direct from Japan on VHS) and actually the dubbing is usually more accurate than when you buy it new... strangely. Mine even have the Japanese commercials, which are often short, but very interesting.

Alucard
07-21-2003, 03:24 AM
If you have commercials then its straight from TV. ie, the same stuff you download off Kazaa. Its fansubbed. The best way to double check this is to go to all the official anime places like Pioneer and ADV and what not, and see if the anime is listed anywhere. MY guess is if its new then theres no chance. Its fansubbed and therefore you can download it.

Seska
07-23-2003, 06:11 AM
There also, of course, is fansubbed anime that uses Japanese dvds as source files. Usually these come a long time after the original eps have been aired,and the fansubs are re-released so people have watch them in beter quality.

Once the shows are licensed in the US hey are usually taken down, though theres people on IRC and kazaa that will still distro them agaisnt the wishes of the original fansubbers.

vherub
07-24-2003, 04:35 PM
anime piracy is ridiculously rampant in terms of downloading due to bittorrent, but also because it seems like there is even less of a moral issue in the anime community due to the proliferation of unauthorized releases of dvds. A quick search on ebay or even amazon.com reveals a trove of "region 0" "import" dvds for a wide range of titles that are almost always illegal to the point where it can be difficult to find the actual licensed release.

Seska
07-25-2003, 04:03 AM
Originally posted by vherub
a wide range of titles that are almost always illegal to the point where it can be difficult to find the actual licensed release.

Nah, its easy to find the "proper" domestic releases on ebay.

They are usually 3 times as expensive. :haha: