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darren
01-07-2012, 04:51 PM
just a rumor ..

But i'll fucking piss myself if its true .. it would be a proper we had better do what Nin are doing day 1 this time ...


i really hope this is not true tho

If the rumors are to be believed, the guts of the new Xbox, presumably some kind of insane multicore CPU and crazy powerful graphics chipset, will be teased nice and early as part of Microsoft's final showing at the Consumer Electronics Show this year. Expect it to be properly revealed, with a name and everything, at the Electronic Entertainment Expo in early June. If that timing is accurate, it seems likely that we'll see it in stores by the 2013 holiday season.

But what of the box itself? Given Microsoft's recent efforts at unification across its Windows, Mobile, and Xbox product lines, it seems clear that the 720 or whatever they end up calling it (surely not that) will be the ultimate personification of that strategy. There are strong signs suggesting that, like with Nintendo's Wii U, a tablet component figures heavily into the new design. That saucy Windows 8 Metro interface (now also seen on the Xbox Dashboard) just begs to be touched. Speculation as to the form it will take has been rife for the past few months, with some even suggesting that the core of the new platform will be akin to a tablet PC that wirelessly connects to a base station, which in turn plugs into your TV. If this is the case, a premium Xbox Next setup could feasibly include a base station, a tablet, a conventional controller of some kind, and the recently discussed high-def evolution of the Kinect. Thank goodness for wireless connections if that's the case; otherwise, we're in for one hell of a mess of cables.


http://uk.gamespot.com/special_feature/2012-predictions/image-feature/index.html

KingOfSentinels
01-07-2012, 05:01 PM
Lawl! So rather than Sony and Microsoft copy Nintendo a few years later, they're doing it straight off the bat.

I don't see this happening. Kinect is going to come in the box this time, they'll be using that and a standard controller. Plus, the tablet for the Wii U isn't cheap. If Xbox 720 is going to be filled to the bring with the latest tech to give us 1080p BF3 gaming at 60 frames, if they throw in a tablet controller with it, it's going to be way too expensive!

darren
01-07-2012, 05:26 PM
MS and Nin can afford to sell at a loss next gen if needs be i'd suggest sony probebly can't but will

KingOfSentinels
01-07-2012, 05:54 PM
That's true.

But with all the things the Xbox already is, I think the cost will be damn high, and so could the loss. It's a big Gaming console expected to be running BF3 graphics at good framerate and resolution, which in itself is very expensive. But it's also a DVR, for games and television, as well as it having Kinect in the box. If it's a tablet controller as well, I think the cost of it is just way too much for a single thing, and Microsoft needs to keep the price low to stay competitive.

Also, Nintendo has patented a tablet controller which has the content streamed to it from the console, so Xbox's tablet will need to have to produce it's own graphics, making it even more expensive.

Seems all a bit too much cost wise.

darren
01-07-2012, 05:56 PM
dunno .. you can get 7" capasitive droid touch screen for 100-150 retail now. the 7" blackberry ones are 200 retail and blackberry ones are pricy .. so if your buying in bulk there must be a good markup on the parts tbh

kinect wont be built into it .. it will still be a stand alone camera.

i think they well sell it stand alone as i suspect you will be able to use your old kinect camera with it if you want instead of buying a new one .. i think kinect is going to be a stand alone product from MS .. so they can upgrade them outside of the console cycle .. so to start with the current kinect will be the default one with the next xbox .. 2 years after the release of the new system .. kinect two drops .. we all have to upgrade part way through the system cycle. its how they get more money from hardware sales.

KingOfSentinels
01-07-2012, 06:10 PM
If the report thinks it'll just be for menu screens, A) seems a bit pointless and B) it'll keep the cost down if they don't need to cram it with enough tech to run it crisp and HD. It'll not be streaming games at least, like Nintendo's, since Nin did patent it in regards to streaming the content, and something to run HD games like that would just be ridiculously expensive. If that's the case though, it'll still cost quite the penny. The cheapest 7'' tablet I see on Amazon, without dipping into the cheap as hell brands, is a Google Android tablet for 75.

Coupled the price of the a PVR for recording games and television; a one for recording in HD, up to 1080i, is 130 at cheapest. The better ones stretch closer to 200 and I doubt they'll throw in a recorder which is anything but HD. Then we have the cost of the actual gaming console itself. I know they'll likely get everything cheaper than what the individual hardware is on Amazon, but even with that reduction, it's going to be pricey all together.

If it's all true, they'll definitely be selling at a loss unless they want it to cost a bundle.

darren
01-07-2012, 06:29 PM
personally i cant see them doing it ..

Kiuju2k
01-07-2012, 08:11 PM
That would be weird. Why then did they even bother with the kinect? Using the kinect with the metro dashboard is pretty good and responsive. I don't want to touch any pad to do anything. Now if it was a tablet control peripheral.

Shorty0061
01-07-2012, 08:21 PM
I would be surprised if this came to fruition. The way MS wants all their windows 8 stuff to communicate with each other, I'm willing to bet there just some connectivity features built into the next xbox that allows it to sync with a windows 8 tablet or something.

Alucard
01-07-2012, 10:35 PM
Love it. I didnt bother with the 360 this gen. Wont kill me if I ignore the next one if the tablet thing is true. I'll play 'their' best games on my pc again.

spider-prime
01-07-2012, 10:57 PM
But what about Halo! YOU WON'T BE PLAYING HALOOOOOOOOOO!

Alucard
01-08-2012, 01:14 AM
/wrists

eastx
01-08-2012, 01:36 AM
I would be surprised if this came to fruition. The way MS wants all their windows 8 stuff to communicate with each other, I'm willing to bet there just some connectivity features built into the next xbox that allows it to sync with a windows 8 tablet or something.

For reals. This rumor is super silly.

Joe Redifer
01-08-2012, 02:06 AM
I just want a game system with normal controllers. Kinect is one thing but it should never be the default controller.

darren
01-08-2012, 04:20 AM
For reals. This rumor is super silly.


While I would love to agree .. Wiiu have a tablet controller .. I hope it's not true but it not that far fetched

Kiuju2k
01-08-2012, 05:19 AM
Even that is fucking insane. That is a huge ass controller, and I know, I just know Nintendo isn't going to make it mandatory to play their games. I had a dreamcast and I rarely if ever used the vmus in game for anything, let a lone play anything out side Chaos and skies of arcadia stuff.

Hasn't nintendo already done this with Final Fantasy already on the gamecube and gameboy advance (used as controller). I don't know man, seems like a bad cash in on something they don't understand. I just know with all the money microsoft invested into the kinect that this control would be useless, but then again, they have the money to blow on something like that, far be it for us to say anything.

darren
01-08-2012, 07:03 AM
7" is not that massive .. My kids tablets are 7" and tbh holding one like a controller did seem to big.

Icarus4578
01-08-2012, 10:04 AM
I just want a game system with normal controllers. Kinect is one thing but it should never be the default controller.

Exactly. These lame gimmick peripherals need to either be optional or just go away. The constant hype around specs and gimmicks is getting tiresome. A console should sell on the strength of its software.

KingOfSentinels
01-08-2012, 10:18 AM
Better hardware and utilities means better software, though. Both are just as important, for neither can survive alone. Bad hardware and shitty controls would ruin good software, and the best ever console and control scheme would be ruined by fuck all good games exactly the same way.

So hype around specs and 'gimmicks' will continue.

Icarus4578
01-08-2012, 10:24 AM
Better hardware and utilities means better software, though. Both are just as important, for neither can survive alone. Bad hardware and shitty controls would ruin good software, and the best ever console and control scheme would be ruined by fuck all good games exactly the same way.

So hype around specs and 'gimmicks' will continue.

That's 100% false! Good software doesn't require super-strong specs, it just requires a good team of creative individuals minus the corporate intervention. The NES had such primitive hardware compared to today yet hosts a slew of fantastic, original, FUN software.

KingOfSentinels
01-08-2012, 10:47 AM
It was good back in the time it was released. But we're talking about this generation, funnily enough, so the NES shouldn't be getting mentioned at all.

Icarus4578
01-08-2012, 10:59 AM
Yeah, it should because I mean to remind everybody how much better gaming used to be at every opportunity. Everyone is too wrapped up in lame gimmickry and technological breakthroughs to see the forest for the trees. Gaming revolves around content, not console power. Games have become little more than interactive movies with little to differentiate them. Microsoft appears to be concerned primarily with horsepower in order to compensate for their lack of creative vision.

KingOfSentinels
01-08-2012, 11:08 AM
Loool! Well, if you want to miss out on stuff like Skyrim, Deus Ex, Portal 2, Bastion, Arkham City, and all the other amazing games we've had this year by deluding yourself like that, then go right on ahead.

Icarus4578
01-08-2012, 11:22 AM
You still don't get it, do you? Microsoft is gearing up for enhanced specs and a potential rip-off of Nintendo's controller but that's about it. That's hardly worthy of excitement. What are they bringing new to the table? Even if they remain with the tried and true, what makes their new console worthy of the investment? Software. My concern is that besides the obvious graphic upgrade, the software line-up will remain largely the same as before. Why, for example, do 90% of the games have a dirty, gritty facade? How much more rampant will microtransactions become and how many more unfinished releases with intentionally locked content will result from abusing this blatant money grab?

KingOfSentinels
01-08-2012, 11:27 AM
Read up on the thread and I don't think any of us were 'excited' by this, and nor saying they were bringing anything new forwards. Because they're not. And 90% of games have the dirty, gritty facade because people like that. I like realism in my games so I can get immersed in them, but that doesn't mean I don't like the colourful titles like Bastion to balance everything out. Indie games are holding that fort perfectly well.

Realism is also an indicator of advancing. Graphics are one of the few things which is objective; liking one game's story over another is opiniated, as is most things. However, in terms of realistic graphics, this is one of the few things that can be objectively judged. I prefer Limbo's graphics to Battlefield 3's, but BF3 has better graphics, objectively speaking. So the more realistic games get, it shows technology going forward really, that's all it is.

Icarus4578
01-08-2012, 11:52 AM
Read up on the thread and I don't think any of us were 'excited' by this, and nor saying they were bringing anything new forwards. Because they're not. And 90% of games have the dirty, gritty facade because people like that. I like realism in my games so I can get immersed in them, but that doesn't mean I don't like the colourful titles like Bastion to balance everything out. Indie games are holding that fort perfectly well.

Games, I feel, should be an escape from reality. Therefore, having things too gritty and realistic destroys the imagination factor. Sure, it works in some instances but having it in the vast majority of contemporary software only highlights the lack of creativity, at least visually.

Realism is also an indicator of advancing. Graphics are one of the few things which is objective; liking one game's story over another is opiniated, as is most things. However, in terms of realistic graphics, this is one of the few things that can be objectively judged. I prefer Limbo's graphics to Battlefield 3's, but BF3 has better graphics, objectively speaking. So the more realistic games get, it shows technology going forward really, that's all it is.

Yes, technology progressively gets stronger, that's a given. But I feel that they can use that horsepower to make things more imaginative than the generic stuff. There's all this potential and hardly anyone is taking advantage.

Kiuju2k
01-08-2012, 05:17 PM
I wouldn't call it a gimmick necessarily. It's a tool to enhance your interactive experience, and personally, I'm all for it, the kinect is fucking awesome with the new live UI. However it is optional, my issue is with tablet based controllers that games will more than likely not require since it will exclude, well, then again, there are kinect only games, so microsoft just might do that.

DBJAY
01-08-2012, 06:15 PM
Food for thought.

1.) Why pay for manufacturing of a tablet, when so many other companies are doing it right now? Entering a crowded area where they would struggle to stand out.

2.) MS has released an XBox Live app for the Iphone, and more on that...

http://articles.businessinsider.com/2012-01-06/tech/30596672_1_windows-phone-android-ios

Therefore, my predicition is that MS will move in the direction of letting other OS on 3rd party tablets become compatible with the 360 in the fall 2012 as a countermove to the Wii U.

darren
01-08-2012, 06:54 PM
With win8 tablets just around the corner I don see ms letting iPad or droid pad users anywhere xbl content outside of the social element they have with the free app already

Badrats Studio
01-10-2012, 01:03 AM
Therefore, my predicition is that MS will move in the direction of letting other OS on 3rd party tablets become compatible with the 360 in the fall 2012 as a countermove to the Wii U.

That would be even awesome if all major available platforms are supported (iOS, Win8 and Android).

Drunken Savior
01-10-2012, 02:44 AM
Games, I feel, should be an escape from reality. Therefore, having things too gritty and realistic destroys the imagination factor.

Ain't nothin' wrong with that. Escapism means different things to different people. It's not your place to say one persons version of escaping 'reality' is better in any way. Escapism doesn't need reach any particular level of imagination.

An 'escape from reality' can mean something like Madden (a stock broker catching the winning touchdown at the superbowl) or Skyrim (a 18 year old nerd slaying the dragon) where one is set in our world and the other is not. So in order for 'escapism' to be effective, your 'imagination factor' really doesn't really need to be factored. It's personal preference.

eastx
01-10-2012, 02:52 AM
Well said, DS.

Icarus4578
01-10-2012, 08:59 AM
Ain't nothin' wrong with that. Escapism means different things to different people. It's not your place to say one persons version of escaping 'reality' is better in any way. Escapism doesn't need reach any particular level of imagination.

Fallacious argument. It would be like me saying it's not your place to argue whether Batman is better in 2D animation or 3D nitty gritty, or whether or not Ys is more imaginative than Zelda. I for one notice the sacrifice in imaginative quality and I'm free to express that. Don't agree? That's your choice.

An 'escape from reality' can mean something like Madden (a stock broker catching the winning touchdown at the superbowl) or Skyrim (a 18 year old nerd slaying the dragon) where one is set in our world and the other is not. So in order for 'escapism' to be effective, your 'imagination factor' really doesn't really need to be factored. It's personal preference.

Thanks for justifying my sentiments with your last sentence. The past generations of gaming were far more imaginative overall than today's. Games such as Gradius, Landstalker, Space Harrier, Marble Madness, and countless others have a genuine VG look and feel to them. I'm not saying that every single realistic game is necessarily bad, but I am making the point that there's an apparent sameness to most contemporary software.

Drunken Savior
01-10-2012, 09:11 AM
LOL, ok Icarus. You win at arguing.

stroopwafel
01-10-2012, 09:11 AM
Semantics aside the games that get made are the games that sell. So if the biggest market on modern consoles are realistic looking military themed FPS multiplayer games then those become the dominant force. Just as platformers were the dominant force during much of the nes/snes era. I also think developers have always strived for the current level of aesthetic sophistication but technical limitations stood in the way. That's why many old games worked their way around these limitations giving them a very specific kind of charm that many people now look back on in nostalgic glee.

Despite the oversaturation of COD and motion control bowling games though excellent games that are abundant in creativity made by designers with obvious love for their craft do still get made. Just last year games like Human Revolution, Skyrim, Dark Souls, Arkham City, Dead Space 2, Limbo etc. more than showed this. So that isn't any less high quality titles than the nes/snes had in any given year. Maybe even moreso, compared to the slew of generic platformers released on those systems back in the day.

Icarus4578
01-10-2012, 09:34 AM
Semantics aside the games that get made are the games that sell. So if the biggest market on modern consoles are realistic looking military themed FPS multiplayer games then those become the dominant force. Just as platformers were the dominant force during much of the nes/snes era.

There's some truth to this, but that doesn't really explain why those games sell. A large portion of the contemporary gaming market is geared towards the teen/young adult male gamer and, since western developers place a strong emphasis on FPS/war simulators which, aside from often being graphic showcases, are very popular with competitive online play, that's where much of the market is drawn. Media hype doesn't hurt, either. As far as older platformers are concerned, since mascot platformers like Mario and Sonic were so successful, it inspired a wave of copycats trying to grab that brass ring. Some were good, others were not-so-good (Bubsy anyone?), but not every platformer was designed with the same look, feel, artistic direction and gameplay. As a matter of fact, there were some radical departures from the norm. Can't say that about most FPS games.

I also think developers have always strived for the current level of aesthetic sophistication but technical limitations stood in the way. That's why many old games worked their way around these limitations giving them a very specific kind of charm that many people now look back on in nostalgic glee.

Somehow I don't think when Hudson Soft originally made Bonk's Adventure that they were aiming for realism. Ditto for Sonic, Gunstar Heroes, Astal, and so forth. Most companies aren't being directed to create based on what the game developers want -- they're just the hired hands -- but rather what the big suits want. That's why you read about how creative people like Keiji Inafune (Capcom) and Masahiro Sakurai (Nintendo/HAL) give up and leave, because they're not being given the freedom to create the games they envision.

Despite the oversaturation of COD and motion control bowling games though excellent games that are abundant in creativity made by designers with obvious love for their craft do still get made. Just last year games like Human Revolution, Skyrim, Dark Souls, Arkham City, Dead Space 2, Limbo etc. more than showed this. So that isn't any less high quality titles than the nes/snes had in any given year. Maybe even moreso, compared to the slew of generic platformers released on those systems back in the day.

I don't see things the same way as you do, but rather than draw up a comparative list of 8/16/23-bit softs, I'll just leave it at that.

Alucard
01-10-2012, 09:41 AM
I'm agreeing with some of Icarus' points. Games are shitter these days for many reasons. There were plenty of military style fps games in the 90s. Back then the over all view of console gamers was that fps games are shit, thats why they didnt play pc games. But the media andgaming sites have been plugging nothing but, so that every retard under the sun suddenly likes fps games and thats all they play.

The media push for most games wasnt strong back in the 80s and most of the 90s except in magazines. Thats the only time you'd see games mentioned. You still bought plenty of games you'd never heard of back then and you'd find stuff you enjoyed. Today you're half force fed the games, plenty of the games you'd buy are swept under the carpet and you only see the mainstream shit. This is whats bought mostly by kids. These are the only games they know of. So many awesome games that dont sell well because the MTV generation know fuck all, only get what they're told to get. Its brand name era.

You can argue it but theres 1 billion examples I could give that back up this.

Icarus4578
01-10-2012, 09:58 AM
To further your argument, Alucard, back then there was also the arcade scene which sort of created this ideal gaming environment which everybody wanted to emulate at home, as well as a vibrant competitive atmosphere. As well, game rental shops were commonplace and, since we didn't have internet videos, this created a sense of wonder and mystery -- you never really knew much about games beside some screenshots and what the printed articles described them as being. Everything was "new" and fresh. Most of the good software today is pushed towards the latter half of the year to meet the holiday shopping rush, so there's definitely less great software spread throughout the year. The big titles always take away sales from the smaller ones and, as a direct consequence, developers are apprehensive about getting their feet wet in creative waters. End result: practically everything has a bland sameness to it. This flies in the face of past generations where there was always something worth looking forward to and much creativity was on display. In order to create a graphic tour-de-force, 20+ hour game also requires a far bigger budget + manpower, whereas back then game development was much cheaper and more focused.

stroopwafel
01-10-2012, 10:24 AM
Somehow I don't think when Hudson Soft originally made Bonk's Adventure that they were aiming for realism. Ditto for Sonic, Gunstar Heroes, Astal, and so forth. Most companies aren't being directed to create based on what the game developers want -- they're just the hired hands -- but rather what the big suits want. That's why you read about how creative people like Keiji Inafune (Capcom) and Masahiro Sakurai (Nintendo/HAL) give up and leave, because they're not being given the freedom to create the games they envision.

This gen you also have games like Ratchet&Clank, Jak&Daxter, Sonic generations etc. that are all bright and colorful platform games. That all games nowadays play the same or have the same visual style is simply not true. However many old games that did aim to have a more 'serious' tone on the relatively primitive hardware back in the day simply wouldn't have existed the way they did if it weren't for technical limitations(think of all the run&gun and action-adventure games). Infact they would be much more like the Uncharted, Mass Effect and God of War games of today. Just think how excited people got at the first sight of full motion video in games and how horrible those FMV games were. There was always a tendency for 'more realism'. There was a turning point somewhere in the 32-bit cycle where games got to be 'more like movies' and the cinematic approach of Metal Gear Solid got that concept nailed. And that is a game made by a guy who also made the 'same' type of game for the nes yet MGS is the game he always wanted to have made if it weren't for technical limitations.

Now you have a situation where modern formulas have gotten old and stale and the idea of on-rails handholding gameplay boring while the simple set-up of classic console game seems fresh and novel again. What makes a good game though is variety and different takes on old formulas, something that doesn't make you feel like going through the same motions over and over again. And those games have always been in the minority, during every generation.

Oh and what great game have Inafune made recently that was so great? Dead Rising was OK but not exactly the kind of game that justifies having the attitude he has. And that was while he was still working for Capcom. He could take a better example of Mikami who doesn't piss and moan but just produces fairly good games as an independent.

Alucard
01-10-2012, 10:42 AM
Well Dead Rising was fairly unique. COD for example, is not. You mention on rails handholding gameplay is boring, but todays stooges seems to find the latest COD game, which is full of that crap, entertaining.

stroopwafel
01-10-2012, 10:50 AM
Well yeah but most of them play it for the multiplayer. Which is even more crap :p

Icarus4578
01-10-2012, 12:21 PM
This gen you also have games like Ratchet&Clank, Jak&Daxter, Sonic generations etc. that are all bright and colorful platform games.

They're cartoony for sure but the visual/gameplay variety still isn't nearly as strong. Also, those series aren't anything new. As a matter of contrast, the older Sonic titles are still better than Generations.

That all games nowadays play the same or have the same visual style is simply not true. However many old games that did aim to have a more 'serious' tone on the relatively primitive hardware back in the day simply wouldn't have existed the way they did if it weren't for technical limitations(think of all the run&gun and action-adventure games). Infact they would be much more like the Uncharted, Mass Effect and God of War games of today.

Says who? Games such as Strider, Contra, Zelda, etc. still work best in 2D. I for one never want a game like Contra to resemble Gears of War nor any other series. In the instances where they make the transition to 3D, they should maintain a similar look & feel.

Just think how excited people got at the first sight of full motion video in games and how horrible those FMV games were. There was always a tendency for 'more realism'. There was a turning point somewhere in the 32-bit cycle where games got to be 'more like movies' and the cinematic approach of Metal Gear Solid got that concept nailed. And that is a game made by a guy who also made the 'same' type of game for the nes yet MGS is the game he always wanted to have made if it weren't for technical limitations.

Very well. That's his vision for the series. As for FMV-based software, most of that stuff was condemned for having little-to-no gameplay, so most people steered clear of those. Exceptions were few: D's, Lunacy, and maybe one or two others. Also, companies would use the CD format to re-release titles with a new FMV opening, redbook CD soundtrack and maybe one or two added levels, hence why disc-based titles didn't really take off for several years.

Now you have a situation where modern formulas have gotten old and stale and the idea of on-rails handholding gameplay boring while the simple set-up of classic console game seems fresh and novel again. What makes a good game though is variety and different takes on old formulas, something that doesn't make you feel like going through the same motions over and over again. And those games have always been in the minority, during every generation.

I strongly disagree. The 8-bit era saw a preponderance of creative risk-taking. 16-bit built upon this foundation and introduced much more exciting stuff. With the introduction of 3D gaming came more risk-taking and experimentation, but the creative cycle dried up with the big budget, mass market appeal that the 64-bit era ushered in, hence the current casual-friendly market.

Oh and what great game have Inafune made recently that was so great? Dead Rising was OK but not exactly the kind of game that justifies having the attitude he has. And that was while he was still working for Capcom. He could take a better example of Mikami who doesn't piss and moan but just produces fairly good games as an independent.

Dead Rising was a pretty good spin on the GTA sandbox engine. We'll never know what he could've gone on to do with Capcom since they were denying him creative freedom, but I guess that's life in the big city.

FinalSolace2
01-11-2012, 12:22 AM
To further your argument, Alucard, back then there was also the arcade scene which sort of created this ideal gaming environment which everybody wanted to emulate at home, as well as a vibrant competitive atmosphere. As well, game rental shops were commonplace and, since we didn't have internet videos, this created a sense of wonder and mystery -- you never really knew much about games beside some screenshots and what the printed articles described them as being. Everything was "new" and fresh. Most of the good software today is pushed towards the latter half of the year to meet the holiday shopping rush, so there's definitely less great software spread throughout the year. The big titles always take away sales from the smaller ones and, as a direct consequence, developers are apprehensive about getting their feet wet in creative waters. End result: practically everything has a bland sameness to it. This flies in the face of past generations where there was always something worth looking forward to and much creativity was on display. In order to create a graphic tour-de-force, 20+ hour game also requires a far bigger budget + manpower, whereas back then game development was much cheaper and more focused.

That's kind of like google search query validity on google search.

I just feel beaten to a pulp when Isearch for something, and I get results for something kim kardashian said or a tom cruise link, and my search was a billion lightyears in the different direction of relation to the two above mentioned people.

Even bing seems to give me less cringing search results.

"Mainstream commercial" Pop culture kills the soul.

KingOfSentinels
01-11-2012, 05:33 AM
Icarus is arguing again? Wow!

I'm gonna play a new game. This is the game where I point out how many times Icarus uses his own opinion as fact!

They're cartoony for sure but the visual/gameplay variety still isn't nearly as strong. Also, those series aren't anything new. As a matter of contrast, the older Sonic titles are still better than Generations.

2!

Says who? Games such as Strider, Contra, Zelda, etc. still work best in 2D. I for one never want a game like Contra to resemble Gears of War nor any other series. In the instances where they make the transition to 3D, they should maintain a similar look & feel.

4!

Very well. That's his vision for the series. As for FMV-based software, most of that stuff was condemned for having little-to-no gameplay, so most people steered clear of those. Exceptions were few: D's, Lunacy, and maybe one or two others. Also, companies would use the CD format to re-release titles with a new FMV opening, redbook CD soundtrack and maybe one or two added levels, hence why disc-based titles didn't really take off for several years.

None. :(

strongly disagree. The 8-bit era saw a preponderance of creative risk-taking. 16-bit built upon this foundation and introduced much more exciting stuff. With the introduction of 3D gaming came more risk-taking and experimentation, but the creative cycle dried up with the big budget, mass market appeal that the 64-bit era ushered in, hence the current casual-friendly market.

5!

Dead Rising was a pretty good spin on the GTA sandbox engine. We'll never know what he could've gone on to do with Capcom since they were denying him creative freedom, but I guess that's life in the big city.

So that's 5. Anyone can beat my score, bring it on. I don't think it'll be too hard to beat though.

eastx
01-11-2012, 05:38 AM
Icarus is arguing again? Wow!

I'm gonna play a new game. This is the game where I point out how many times Icarus uses his own opinion as fact!

So that's 5. Anyone can beat my score, bring it on.

Just wait till his next post. The number usually goes up exponentially as he repeats his lame arguments over and over in the thread.

Escaflowne2001
01-11-2012, 07:13 AM
Oh and what great game have Inafune made recently that was so great? Dead Rising was OK but not exactly the kind of game that justifies having the attitude he has. And that was while he was still working for Capcom. He could take a better example of Mikami who doesn't piss and moan but just produces fairly good games as an independent.

He's lowered himself into making cameo's in Loli JRPGs. :lol:

Icarus4578
01-11-2012, 09:01 AM
That's kind of like google search query validity on google search.

I just feel beaten to a pulp when Isearch for something, and I get results for something kim kardashian said or a tom cruise link, and my search was a billion lightyears in the different direction of relation to the two above mentioned people.

Even bing seems to give me less cringing search results.

"Mainstream commercial" Pop culture kills the soul.

Not sure I follow.

Icarus is arguing again? Wow!

I'm gonna play a new game. This is the game where I point out how many times Icarus uses his own opinion as fact!

...

So that's 5. Anyone can beat my score, bring it on. I don't think it'll be too hard to beat though.

Am I using my opinions as facts or simply stating my opinions? Hypothetically speaking, if Konami releases a new 3D Castlevania and I opine that the 2D ones are better, I'm worthy of being singled out? Or, if I argue that the PlayStation software is better than the Xbox's, I'm guilty of the same? Name for me one person who doesn't express their views.

eastx
01-11-2012, 09:46 AM
Am I using my opinions as facts or simply stating my opinions? Hypothetically speaking, if Konami releases a new 3D Castlevania and I opine that the 2D ones are better, I'm worthy of being singled out? Or, if I argue that the PlayStation software is better than the Xbox's, I'm guilty of the same? Name for me one person who doesn't express their views.

If you state it as if it was a fact, then yes. KOS already highlighted the parts in which you did that. See, not everybody will agree with your 'facts' and thus we don't follow along with your train of thought at all.

KingOfSentinels
01-11-2012, 09:56 AM
Am I using my opinions as facts or simply stating my opinions? Hypothetically speaking, if Konami releases a new 3D Castlevania and I opine that the 2D ones are better, I'm worthy of being singled out? Or, if I argue that the PlayStation software is better than the Xbox's, I'm guilty of the same? Name for me one person who doesn't express their views.


None, obviously. But you use them to argue against people and make their point wrong, as if your opinion validates your points like a fact. On the post I quoted, you didn't say "I don't think the visual/gameplay variety still isn't nearly as strong". You just say "The visual/gameplay variety still isn't nearly as strong" and use that as if it's a fact.

And again, you said "Games such as Strider, Contra, Zelda, etc. still work best in 2D.", you didn't say "I think games such as Strider, Contra, Zelda, etc. still work best in 2D." And that's in every thread I've seen you post in.

You constantly disguise your opinion with fact, and I've not once seen you concede to anything anyone else has said unless it's what your exact opinion was when entering the thread. You always find a way not to, and end up just repeating the exact same points constantly even as others try and make you see otherwise. Like in the thread a while ago, you kept pointing out minority exceptions to the rule even as we said they're just exceptions, and you did this for about 3 or 4 posts. It's pointless to even try. Like when Darren and Alucard where disagreeing with me about 2GB of RAM being enough for the Xbox 720. After the good points they brought up, I ended up agreeing with them. I changed my opinion. I have yet to see you ever do that.

DS ignored you, and I think I'll start doing the same, because I just can't be arsed with discussions which go absolutely nowhere.

Icarus4578
01-11-2012, 10:46 AM
I have an inflexible, rigid way of thinking, but if you're too shallow as to not tell the difference between an opinion and a fact, well, that's your observation. So be it.

By all means, go ahead and ignore me. Do you think that you're hurting my feelings or something?

*edit* Oh, and I'll continue to illustrate my disappointment at the corporate hegemony that suffocates the contemporary VG industry.

eastx
01-11-2012, 11:30 AM
I have an inflexible, rigid way of thinking, but if you're too shallow as to not tell the difference between an opinion and a fact, well, that's your observation. So be it.

By all means, go ahead and ignore me. Do you think that you're hurting my feelings or something?

*edit* Oh, and I'll continue to illustrate my disappointment at the corporate hegemony that suffocates the contemporary VG industry.

Sticking your fingers in your ears when people give you honest and constructive criticism is a terrific way not to improve and keep annoying everybody.

progmetal
01-11-2012, 11:50 AM
I read everything Icarus said as his opinion, not fact.

He never said "this is a fact" after every sentence, hence it's his opinion. You shouldn't have to say IMO after everything. Most people can see it as opinions as long as you don't say specifc that it's a fact.

How hard can it be?

darren
01-11-2012, 12:07 PM
^^^^^^ hes talking fact here guys .. FACT

Drunken Savior
01-11-2012, 12:20 PM
Yeah, guy just wants to bitch about how he hates modern gaming. That's fine. Not why I post on this message board though. I actually like playing games and want to discuss them with others that do. I don't like discussing games with people who only bitch about the past.

Icarus4578
01-11-2012, 12:32 PM
Sticking your fingers in your ears when people give you honest and constructive criticism is a terrific way not to improve and keep annoying everybody.

That's not "honest and constructive criticism" but rather a desire to make me conform. Sorry I don't preclude everything I type with the statement "In my opnion" just to please you.

Hmm, let's see here. Not trying to blow my own horn but I contributed hundreds of reviews, enough to inspire many others to follow suit and, hence, the creation of an entire sub-section dedicated to member reviews. I also contributed the Random Pictures thread, which in turn inspired Seska to do the same for videos. Both threads still going strong today. I've sent many members here mix CDs and other cool stuff ...and never asked for anything in return. The ball is in your court: What have you contributed here besides launching immature attacks at me every chance you get?

I've been gaming for as long as I can remember, from the days of the Atari and Colecovision to the Commodore, NES and Genesis on up to this day. I was right there pumping quarters into that Neo Geo, TMNT and Street Fighter II arcade cabinet. I know this industry well enough that my opinion has some merit, even if you or whoever else doesn't see eye-to-eye. I debate these issues because I feel strongly about them and want to see this industry change for the better, but that won't happen, not so long as people continue to conform to the way things are. Will the creative forces' actions within this industry be forever dictated by corporate big-wigs? Will the consumer continue to conform to mass media hype and happily dish out cash for the latest rehash or flavor of the month gimmickry? Will the rampant greed continue to hold content hostage to the microtransaction? Will the next generation propel the acquision/demise of the independent (creative) developers due to exorbitant development costs while the big players continue to get bigger and stronger?

These are serious questions that need answers. Just because you don't agree with me or the manner in which I express my views doesn't invalidate my presence.

Icarus4578
01-11-2012, 12:45 PM
Yeah, guy just wants to bitch about how he hates modern gaming. That's fine. Not why I post on this message board though. I actually like playing games and want to discuss them with others that do. I don't like discussing games with people who only bitch about the past.

I don't need to defend myself against you, DS. Needless to say, you're not in a position to talk, bringing friggin' Batman into every thread.

Drunken Savior
01-11-2012, 12:50 PM
LOL, ok Icarus. I will try not to bring up Batman so much since it's apparently pissing off everyone and I don't have a huge list of contributions to the forums to defend my carefree nature of bringing up Batman in a lighthearted nature.

Icarus4578
01-11-2012, 12:54 PM
LOL, ok Drunken Savior, because it's all good since you're just a care-free dude who brings up a character created in 1939 for the sake of amusement, then ridicules me for living in the past.

Drunken Savior
01-11-2012, 12:56 PM
Are you done? Because I am. No one cares about you defending your ego. (Goes back to playing modern video games on his PC)

Icarus4578
01-11-2012, 12:59 PM
If you're referring to making my point, I think so, yes. And you, are you finished grandstanding by throwing indirect insults my way, or is that ok just because you're a moderator?

Drunken Savior
01-11-2012, 01:00 PM
I'm not a moderator.

Icarus4578
01-11-2012, 01:00 PM
You were though at one point, so it's not like you don't have any leverage in that regard.

Drunken Savior
01-11-2012, 01:02 PM
....I really don't. No one here gives a shit that I was once a moderator. Trust me.

Furthermore, I think this thread had derailed, in a negative way, long enough to the point where we're taking this personal thing too far.

Icarus4578
01-11-2012, 01:05 PM
Very well. Just know that I won't sit quietly while you, eastx or whoever take cheap shots at me because I don't do that to you nor anyone else unprovoked.

KingOfSentinels
01-11-2012, 01:21 PM
I read everything Icarus said as his opinion, not fact.

He never said "this is a fact" after every sentence, hence it's his opinion. You shouldn't have to say IMO after everything. Most people can see it as opinions as long as you don't say specifc that it's a fact.

How hard can it be?

Yes but it's how his opinions are then used to undermine that of others, as if they are undeniable fact. It's all well and good stating your opinion on the subject, that's the entire point of a forum basically; but for instance, his second post in this entire thread was saying directly to me "You're 100% wrong". If someone said that to me to my face I'd just tell them to go fuck off. If he'd said "I disagree" or something to that regard it would be fine, but he just said you're wrong, then proved me wrong with his opinion. So naturally I'd get a bit pissed off at that, especially in that it's far from the first time he's done it both to me and to others.

Icarus4578
01-11-2012, 01:26 PM
Very well then. I won't express my opinions so strongly in the future. That way, you have no grounds for a personal vendetta.

Jeez.

KingOfSentinels
01-11-2012, 01:33 PM
It's not a personal vendetta. Just a quite big annoyance. And that sounds fine, nice to see us reach a worthwhile conclusion to a discussion. :thumb-up:

Drunken Savior
01-11-2012, 01:36 PM
I love a happy ending. Especially when they are on the house!

eastx
01-11-2012, 01:42 PM
I love a happy ending. Especially when they are on the house!

Tablet controllers for everyone! :spinface:

Drunken Savior
01-11-2012, 01:43 PM
(throws barstool at EastX) :jim:

KingOfSentinels
01-11-2012, 01:46 PM
Moving onto the topic at hand...

I agree with DBJAY and Darren, waaaaaaaaaaaaaay back on Page 2, in that this tablet rumour might just be support for the tablet. Whatever Source discovered this could have just seen plans for this. Windows 8 tablets will probably be able to link up to the console and you'll be able to control it with one, and maybe play games on the tablet on the huge screen through the Xbox maybe. Something like that. Be a nice little feature.

If they manage to squeeze in a quite large tablet into the already quite expensive sounding console, I will be impressed. :D

progmetal
01-11-2012, 02:28 PM
And if Sony can get their act together and show proper support for remote play this time, all consoles will have a sort of tablet support.

darren
01-11-2012, 04:28 PM
....I really don't. No one here gives a shit that I was once a moderator. Trust

I do .. I have a littl shrine and everything on my deck

And whAt was the topic anyway?

eastx
01-11-2012, 06:12 PM
....I really don't. No one here gives a shit that I was once a moderator. Trust me.

Now that you mention it, what's the story there? Why did you stop being one? Too many hours of mod duties every day??

Joe Redifer
01-11-2012, 07:15 PM
I banned him from being a mod for three basic reasons:

1) People should not stay in power (except me)
2) I felt DS needed to focus his attention on getting his education back on track and this was the only way this could happen.
3) I knew I could do great running the place with Vegetto. Remember him?

But really, this place is great because it doesn't need much baby-sitting and spam isn't as much of an issue as it once was.

Icarus4578
01-11-2012, 07:33 PM
I don't recall spam being too much of a hassle around here. In general most people come here to post about video games and such.

KingOfSentinels
01-11-2012, 07:55 PM
There's the odd people who come on, say something random like 'This game is good thanks for the post!' and have a signature full of adverts. :P

But yeah, I like MB since the rules are quite relaxed because nobody breaks them. Makes a nice change from other places with Nazi rulers who ban you for making a spelling mistake or insulting their favourite game. If we started talking about rape on a Wii U thread on Neogaf, we would wave bye bye to that place.

Joe Redifer
01-11-2012, 08:14 PM
I used to have to approve each new registration and that was a huge pain. I implemented a Q&A thing so we get very few spambots who make it through now.

Alucard
01-12-2012, 12:36 AM
Well screw you all, yesterdays games were by far on a percentage of titles, FAR better then todays shit. Console at least. If you want to argue that point, try recall 10 rpgs you loved on the older popular systems to the new ones. snes/psx/ps2/360-ps3 whatever you think on those two. Go and compare those 10 from each system and see which ones you loved more. I'm hard fucking pressed to recall 5 rpgs I enjoyed on current gen, this goes for all genres.

Theres my fact, straight from your heads.

Drunken Savior
01-12-2012, 01:01 AM
This is just bait into an argument on what is, and is not, an RPG.

Einhander
01-12-2012, 01:11 AM
Whatever happened to Vegetto?

Alucard
01-12-2012, 01:44 AM
This is just bait into an argument on what is, and is not, an RPG.

Halo is an rpg.

Pikachief
01-12-2012, 03:19 AM
This is just bait into an argument on what is, and is not, an RPG.

Reminds me when I got into an argument with someone about what is and what isn't an MMO.

After he said that Halo was an MMO because it has a massive amount of players online I stopped arguing.

Can't really argue with a guy who basically things if a game is online it automatically makes it an MMO because a large amount of people can be online on the servers at once. lol

Alucard
01-12-2012, 03:52 AM
You're crazy. Halo is the first MMO rpg.

Icarus4578
01-12-2012, 08:51 AM
You're all crazy. The first MMO was back on the Sega Genesis. Using the revolutionary technology of the TeleGenesis Modem, Altered Beast was the first true MMO RPG.

http://homepage.mac.com/greggillis/images/19891990/genesisIntroAd.jpg

YEAAAAAAAAAAAH!

Alucard
01-12-2012, 09:12 AM
Halo was made before that.

Icarus4578
01-12-2012, 09:19 AM
YOU LIE!

Alucard
01-12-2012, 09:29 AM
TRUTH! Ask any halo fan! Halo was the first EVERYTHING!

Joe Redifer
01-12-2012, 01:07 PM
Hollo Fighter™ was the best game evar.

KingOfSentinels
01-12-2012, 01:15 PM
TRUTH! Ask any halo fan! Halo was the first EVERYTHING!

It is true. Halo was made on the 8th day after God had rested. He needed to use all of his strength to make it.

darren
02-10-2012, 12:49 PM
errrrr please no

http://www.evilsourcegaming.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/mG5vh.jpg

http://www.evilsourcegaming.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/mG5vh.jpg

Nem
02-10-2012, 01:04 PM
Yeah i saw that news piece.

My interpretation of it is Microsoft is heading towards disaster (setting themselves with a product equal to the Wii U without the Nintendo exclusives) and are giving Sony the diferentiation they need: only console with classic controller, wich will appeal alot more to hardcore gamers. This, assuming Sony sticks to the classic formula and dont embark on this tablet controller sillyness.

KingOfSentinels
02-10-2012, 02:03 PM
I agree with Nem. They won't match the innovation and exclusives that Nintendo will have using this tablet-style controller, and at the same time, lose the 'harcore' edge to the PS4, which will likely have standard controls and probably more power to boot, and could offer that for much less. They'll be slap-bang in the middle, and without a good price tag, I don't see that boding too well for MS. Xbox doesn't really have the exclusives to rely upon either.

eastx
02-10-2012, 02:35 PM
I do not know what to think about the rumor...

darren
02-10-2012, 02:41 PM
i see sony having exactly the same controller on the ps4 the wiiu and nextbox have

Alucard
02-10-2012, 03:24 PM
Same, I see sony doing this also. I think the two companies are just purposely trolling nintendo. I find it all very entertaining. btw, I hear the pc is still going to be the same and wont be going the route of 'fuck around with our gaming fanbase every half decade'.

darren
02-10-2012, 03:44 PM
i heard the keyboard/mouse is also being replaced with a touch pad

Alucard
02-10-2012, 04:00 PM
Noooooooooooooooooooooo

progmetal
02-10-2012, 04:32 PM
I saw some patent drawings from Sony with a tablet device and a game system.

This was before the WiiU was known to anybody. Seems like Sony have the patents, but seldom actually manufacture it.

spider-prime
02-10-2012, 05:04 PM
joy, more things that will sit in most people's closets. *looks at the power pad and wii balance board*

progmetal
02-10-2012, 05:24 PM
http://www.abload.de/img/sony-patent-app-3-e13jvdhh.png
http://www.abload.de/img/sony-patent-app-431c6w.png

KingOfSentinels
02-10-2012, 05:42 PM
joy, more things that will sit in most people's closets. *looks at the power pad and wii balance board*

I don't think this is like that at all. These tablets will really benefit gaming, there's a lot of innovative things developers could do with them. As long as the tablets compliment good controls, rather than be the controls, I see nothing wrong with them at all, and they'll benefit the games, rather than hinder like motion controls sometimes do.

However, in MS' case, this seems a bit needless and tacked on, and will just drive up the price of an already expensive console. They have Kinect, I don't know why they're shoving more in.

darren
02-10-2012, 06:06 PM
joy, more things that will sit in most people's closets. *looks at the power pad and wii balance board*

Err if it's the control pad it's not going to sit in the closet.

Einhander
02-10-2012, 06:14 PM
I can't wait to see how shitty next gen is going to be.

spider-prime
02-10-2012, 06:16 PM
Go on keep believing that. I shall await it's doom.



Err if it's the control pad it's not going to sit in the closet.


It will if it sucks balls.

darren
02-10-2012, 07:38 PM
Then it won't just be the default controller in the closet.

spider-prime
02-10-2012, 08:11 PM
Your right, it will be THEE default controller in the closet.

thesoftware6180
02-11-2012, 03:57 AM
I don't think this will be the standard controller. MS is attempting to bring windows 8 together on all of their devices. I can see a windows 8 tablet being able to interact with the next xbox and mabey act as a controller of some sort to play games, but it wont be the main control pad.

spider-prime
02-16-2012, 06:32 PM
Apparently the rumor that one of the companies won't be making a console, sony or ms, might be true and the rumor is that the tablet is real and that it is in a way, the console. It will be powerful enough to plug into your tv and still use controllers and other stuff like kinect. It will have a charging dock that comes with more ports and other stuff that plugs into the TV.

These are all rumors.

But apparently from what I've heard, they are trying to make a portable console. Which would also coincide with the rumor of one game per console and no sharing. The dvd discs will only be for installing it onto the tablet which will be installed from the docking station.

Take with a grain of salt, but I wouldn't be surprised. I can see this happening. This is just stuff I heard from a guy I talk to that works for certain companies I'm not allowed to say cause he could get fired. He hasn't seen it but heard his bosses talking about it. He could have just meant other rumors and nothing official.

Nem
02-17-2012, 08:53 AM
I can see it happening... and i can see it failing magnifically.

I mean, it will probably work for the average consumer, but it wont for hardcore gamers.

I still think they are giving Sony the cake by positioning themselves as a tablet product. They are focusing too much on beeing the new Nintendo.

KingOfSentinels
02-17-2012, 02:48 PM
There's so many rumours, I don't know what to believe anymore. :lol: I'm just going to wait and see. We of the master race care not for your dirty next generation anyways.

We should make our own rumour...

Hey guys, did you know the Nextbox can be climbed into and you can fly it to work?!

darren
02-17-2012, 03:12 PM
i heard the master race default controller next gen is x10 old atari stick glued together with an ngage dispay in the middle

Alucard
02-17-2012, 03:27 PM
http://fullnovazero.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/gloriouspcgamingmasterrace.png


http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs44/f/2009/140/2/2/PC_Gaming_Master_Race_by_Claidheam_Righ.jpg

http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/50500_332561550002_3894078_n.jpg

progmetal
02-17-2012, 03:34 PM
PC Gamer:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Xp5P7eZ6MEM/TaOkSllX2oI/AAAAAAAAAAs/wzfbPvLjUpc/s1600/computer-nerd-funny.jpg

Alucard
02-17-2012, 03:38 PM
You wish you were that hot

darren
02-17-2012, 03:40 PM
could be worse .. could have to prance around like this while gaming

http://www.csmonitor.com/var/ezflow_site/storage/images/media/images/2010/0927-weekly/0927-vmove-02-innovation-technology-games-gaming/8660813-1-eng-US/0927-VMOVE-02-INNOVATION-TECHNOLOGY-GAMES-GAMING_full_600.jpg

KingOfSentinels
02-17-2012, 03:41 PM
His shit's legit.

Reality
02-17-2012, 11:09 PM
I'll take being a PC gamer over logging to Xbox Live to fight these Call of Duty adolescent little girls.

http://millennialmarketing.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/child-gamer.bmp

spider-prime
02-18-2012, 12:27 AM
PC multiplayer gaming still can't be beat.

Teamspeak/ventrilo for cross gaming chat beats xbox live over anything.

eastx
02-18-2012, 01:53 AM
PC multiplayer gaming still can't be beat.

Teamspeak/ventrilo for cross gaming chat beats xbox live over anything.

But Xbox Live has cross-game party chat, which is pretty much the same thing.

Alucard
02-18-2012, 02:03 AM
Fuck those two. They seem to have a 2second lag when chatting with people overseas. Stick with skype.

KingOfSentinels
02-18-2012, 05:02 AM
Screw Skype, I hate the lack of a push-to-talk key when on teh chats. Another reason I hate Xbox's chat.

"Hey guys, let's attack this base, we need to- WHAT? WHAT? NO I DON'T WANT A SANDWICH. WHAT? MOM NO I DON'T WANT A SANDWICH DON'T MAKE ME A SANDWICH?! WHAT?" etc. etc.

Teamspeak all the way! Or I just use in-game. I remember my friends used to want to talk on Teamspeak while playing Left 4 Dead, and I never understood that since L4D has a pretty good quality in-game chat anyway.

Alucard
02-18-2012, 05:20 AM
Steam chat is the second best thing then