Sony PS2's secret weapon!

[Overlord]

The Performance Analyzer

What this does is it tells the devs about which part of the PS2 hardware is working the most and the least. So they can use all of the system resources all at ones. It might also make all the games look generations better than the ones we have now, if used properly. PS2 is the hardest console to develope for, so this might also help some devs get over a slump.

...PSx also had one. Before it, all the games looked really bad. But when this came out. All the games started looking better and better.

I think it is due out 2002, not sure when it exactly comes out.

Sidenote: Gran Turismo 3 uses 25% o the PS2's full power. Sony used a system analyzer or something to fiqure it out.

[Burning Shingo]

Yes, the Performance Analyser will be a useful tool. I remember similar things being said about the original Gran Turismo on PSX - but was there really a great improvement between that and later titles?

[Overlord]

Well, some devlopers knew the system better than others. So they had a advantage in making game that were had better graphics. But the analyzer also helps with things like lightning effects, better AI etc. PSx was really easy to dev for. Its a differant story with the PS2.

...And Polphony is a PSx/2 second party exclusive. So they might have gotten a dev kit before other devs. So they had more time with hardware

[hgblob]

Originally posted by Overlord
...And Polphony is a PSx/2 second party exclusive.

<nitpick>

Actually, Polyphony Digital is first party.

</nitpick>

[Overlord]

<nitpick>

Actually, Polyphony Digital is first party.

</nitpick>


Yeah, Polyphony. That?s what I meant. I was just typing really fast, and didn't proof read everything.

...And I think it would be 2nd party. First party is the main company makes the game. Such as Sony-->PS2, Nintendo-->Gamecube, and Microsoft-->XBox. And Sony might own a part of Polyphony, but it's still 2nd party, since its exclusive. Third party are games that can be multi-platform, not exclusive.

[Black Ace]

Beside GT, what does Polyphony Digital offers?

[testtubebaby]

well... they did Omega Boost...

*cough*

[Overlord]

Beside GT, what does Polyphony Digital offers?


Huge sales numbers.

...GT3 sold 6.6 million copies a while back(and that includes the PS2-GT3 bundles). I think it was in February. So it is the best selling game on the PS2 right now. And that is the worldwide number, not just US. It also got 39/40 from Famitsu, which also helped sales.

And GT1 and GT2 combined to sale number around 16 million or something. Plus Sony Publishes the game, so they also get a piece of the pie.

[testtubebaby]

Originally posted by Overlord
...GT3 sold 6.6 million copies a while back(and that includes the PS2-GT3 bundles). I think it was in February. So it is the best selling game on the PS2 right now.

i'm fairly sure that i have read that GTA3 is the best selling PS2 game of all time... at least in the U.S.

[Overlord]

Your right that GTA3 is the best selling game in the US. When GT3 reached around 6.6 mill, GTA3 was around 4.4. GTA3 was the 3rd highest selling game at the time. MGS2 had 4.7million sales(including 1.7mill pre-orders in Europe...). And FFX was 4th with 4.2 million sales.

...But at the time GT3 was already out worldwide. And GTA3 was only out in US and Europe. But that?s still amazing how much they sold in two countries. I'm not about Australia version of the game.

But months has passed. So the gap might be closer now.

[Black Ace]

Ignored this.

[testtubebaby]

GTA3 hasn't/will not be released in japan...

were the previous gta's released there? anyone know?

[Overlord]

Well I just check MagicBox platinum chart, the best selling PS2 game in Japan was Final Fantasy X, with over 2 million sold, GT3 sold about 1.5 million. As for the US numbers, I'm looking for a page that has it.


Well, you also have to look at other countries game sale numbers. Such as Europe, Canada, New Zealand and Australia. That?s where GT3 also sold really well.

...You'll definitely need to check with Europe to get the full number on GTA3.

[Black Ace]

Whoops, I made a mistaked, I mis-read it, got confused with GT3 and GTA3. Sorry. lol :D

[Black Ace]

GTA3 did sell a bucket load in the US, it was the best selling game of October through February this year, it was knocked off to second in March by Super Mario Advance 2.

[Overlord]

GTA3 did sell a bucket load in the US, it was the best selling game of October through February this year, it was knocked off to second in March by Super Mario Advance 2.


Yeah, I think that was also the week/month the two Sonic games made the Top 5.

...People are still suprised that GTA3 sold a lot better than MGS2, considering the Hype. MGS2 was in first place for about two weeks when came out. It came out after GTA3. But a lot of people(1.8 million)bought it on the first two weeks. Same thing with FFX.

[devie]

GTA3 did really well in England, it was at the top of the charts since it came out. It's not on top now of course, MGS2 is. But still since early december till now, that's a looooong time.

[ATMA]

About sony's secret weapon thingie .well that's one of the reasons why i think alot of devolpers stay with ps2 (not only for the sales )..but they know it has alot more than what it's offering now ..I mean look at square with FFVII just when you thought wow look at this graphics they found a way to get more out of the psx and they made FFXIII
and so on ..And if the devolpers keep experimenting with the ps2 i'm sure we are gonna see alot more great graphics out there. Look at that game uhm ..rachet & clank !! In my opinion the game allready will score higher on the graphics comparing to jack & daxter !! (and it's a working title )..i think they found a new way to get more out of the ps2 and that's how it will go and with this analyzer thing it might help devolpers to get more out of the ps2 !! I'm looking foward for that !!! And GT3 only used 25%
of the ps2 ??:eek: KICKAAAAAAAAASS!!! wow ..that's amazing !!! So in the near future we might see some amazing things i mean if some one devolpe a game that uses about 98% of the ps2 ,That would be amazing !! Well i've always believed in the devolpers and not the performence of the console ...so a huge amount of MHZ doesn't impress me ..for real !!!! ALL bout the devolpers !! And yes GTA3 did indeed verry good .especially in england ,but i think MGS2 outsell it worldwide
but i could be wrong i don't have a saleschart with me right now !!!

[Wolf]

Remember how good games like Metal Gear Solid, Omega Boost, Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver and Gran Turismo looked when they came out? Thats because, as was mentioned, developers were given access to the performance analyzer. A system that lets developers fine tune their code and lets graphic algorithms like mation blur, light sourcing and a whole bunch of other cool effects be possible without bogging the engine down. Not to mention that developers at that time had 3-4 years to tinker with the PSX.

Now it's about that same time with the PS2. Developers had access to the kits in 1999, so some have been able to really utilize the EE. Witht the analyzer, skilled developers will be able to crank out spectacular effects. Just wait for Final Fanatsy XII or Metal Gear Solid 3. I am sure GT4 is gonna make GT3 look bad too. ;)

[Overlord]

. Look at that game uhm ..rachet & clank !! In my opinion the game allready will score higher on the graphics comparing to jack & daxter !! (and it's a working title )..i think they found a new way to get more out of the ps2 and that's how it will go and with this analyzer thing it might help devolpers to get more out of the ps2 !!


I agree with you all the way. That game will turn some heads when it comes out. There?s still some people that believe that the PS2 was maxed out last year. This will be quite a surprise for them.

...I also thought about how FFVII looked great when it first came out. But after you compare it with FVIII, well...


So what if FFX is PS2's FFVII, think how much FFXII and FFXIII will look!

GT4 is already in the works, I'm not sure if they handed out the Analyzers yet, but if they did. Polyphony Digital would be one of the ones to get it.

[Dog]

GT3 used 25% of the PS2's power? Don't believe the Marketting Hype. The performance analyser will surely help those developers (who give a damn) to increase the performance of their games, but just cos it exists doesn't mean everyone will use it. From what I read in EDGE magazine the analyser is one of the very last tools used by a developer in the cycle of making a game - at that stage they just wanna get rid and not start dredging up their code and optimising it line by line. Hell that could even prove dangerous if bug testing had already begun. Secret weapon? Nah... Just another tool that a developer can either chose to use or not.

[Overlord]

The performance analyser will surely help those developers (who give a damn) to increase the performance of their games, but just cos it exists doesn't mean everyone will use it.


Naughty Dog will surely be one of the devs who use will it to enhance there games. They seem to be one of the most devoted to the hardware. And they even call the devs who doesn't work on it lazy. That?s what they called Oddworld Inhabitants(habitants?) when they canceled there game on the PS2 because they felt it was to difficult.

...And this time around, I think more people will use it. The reason that the PSx games might not have used it is probably because it was really easy to develop for. And it's not the same thing with the PS2.

Plus there?s that Vector C thing also coming out.

[Dog]

God no - PSX was also a nightmare machine! (maybe more so for game artists than programmers). But I think MS might of had its hand in the shifting of platforms for Oddworld. Wads of money can be a wonderful thing :)

[teepo]

developers have had access to the performance anaylizer for well over a year now.

ps2 "new secret weapon" is the new dev kit that was supposdly suppose to become aviable to developers in early march.

[Overlord]

Of course there was also money involved when Oddworld made there decision.

...Graphically, the PSx was a nightmare machine to dev for. But it was the easiest to develop for at the time. There?s a reason why the N64 didn't have much 3rd party support.

And now the PS2 is the hardest to dev for. But the Vector C kit might change all that.

Money-wise, the PSx was also pretty cheap to dev for.

[Dog]

Actually the N64 was the easiest to develop for - problem was all your artists needed an SGI that's 40 grand already then of course there's the price of the cart.

[typexig]

PS2's graphics will get better everyear...but it all depends on the developers..if they take their time and dont get lazy.. developers should be devoted to the console theyre developing..more...back then games took really long to make..thats why theyre better..now a days, games takes 1 year to develope. and thats why many games are not good right now...i think developers should take their time more and not rush the games.

-Xig-

[hgblob]

Originally posted by Overlord


Yeah, Polyphony. That?s what I meant. I was just typing really fast, and didn't proof read everything.

...And I think it would be 2nd party. First party is the main company makes the game. Such as Sony-->PS2, Nintendo-->Gamecube, and Microsoft-->XBox. And Sony might own a part of Polyphony, but it's still 2nd party, since its exclusive. Third party are games that can be multi-platform, not exclusive.

Polyphony Digital was originally known as Team Polys, an internal development team in Sony Computer Entertainment in Japan. Just before the first Gran Turismo game was released, Sony decided to give them more autonomy in games development. They dissolved Team Polys and created Polyphony Digital. All the Sony employees who were in Team Polys were then put into Polyphony Digital. Hence, they were and still are 1st party.

(I got this from the games developers pages in IGN.)

[ATMA]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Overlord
[B]
So what if FFX is PS2's FFVII, think how much FFXII and FFXIII will look!




Overlord that's the reason why i love square they always find a way to get more out of the system !!!And alot of other companies when they bring out a next installment of their previous game they use the same engine and it's like they can get more out of the console while there's always a possibility!! I can't wait indeed to see FFXII i bet it's gonna make FFX look like an outdated game
i'm not counting FFXI cause that one is something different but with FFXII they will go back to the roots !!And i rather not start to think about FFXII right now ..other whise the waiting will be muuuuuuuch longer ..lets concentrate on FFXI first
:D

[Overlord]

Overlord that's the reason why i love square they always find a way to get more out of the system !!!And alot of other companies when they bring out a next installment of their previous game they use the same engine and it's like they can get more out of the console while there's always a possibility!! I can't wait indeed to see FFXII i bet it's gonna make FFX look like an outdated game
i'm not counting FFXI cause that one is something different but with FFXII they will go back to the roots !!And i rather not start to think about FFXII right now ..other whise the waiting will be muuuuuuuch longer ..lets concentrate on FFXI first


Your right. You would think that companies will learn on how to improve there games, besides just using the same engine, and making a rehash. Theres still a lot of good companies out there. But theres also a lot that are really bad.

[Rubeus]

I herad Gran Turismo 3 has already reached 8 millions worldwide! As for Final Fantasy X, the 4.4 million figure will probably reach even high after the figures from Euro are in.

[Overlord]

Rebeus:
I herad Gran Turismo 3 has already reached 8 millions worldwide! As for Final Fantasy X, the 4.4 million figure will probably reach even high after the figures from Euro are in.

8 million sounds right. And it probably will sell more than GT1 and GT2, not combined. I expect FFX to sell well over 7 million units. It might even double from what they have now.

[typexig]

i dont think that the PS2 will every use it's full potential. i think before sony release PS3, PS2 will probably use around 70%-80% of its full potentials.. i read somewhere that even the PSone never actually used up its full potentials. i heard that they only got up to 80%..=)

-Xig-

[Seska]

I generally agree that most consoles begin to show what they really can do after their third or fourth year running. True, FF8 did look a lot better than FF7. But the difference between FF8 and FF9 was not that great (other than the aspect of the visual designs). While games like FF10, Jak and Daxter, MGS2 have profoundly impressed me in their visial quality, I do have to wonder if we will see THAT much of an improvement in future games.

[ATMA]

It's true i was amazed by some of the graphics
and started to wondering what will be the next step and how will they make it on the graphic area
even better than the one before !!
But maybe they've come to a level where you won't make a really huge impact anymore now, so maybe now they can concentrate more on the gameplay and story !!

[ATMA]

Yes i think FFX may sell alot worldwide ..over a few days it will be launch here (and i played mine in january through ..i pitty PAL system)
i know acouple of guys that are dying to play that game and i'm sure most Europeans can't wait either i think it will do very good in the selling area lets wait for like a month or two !!Won't surprise me if it gets to 7 or 9 million units worldwide!!! gooooo Square !!!! :D

[Overlord]

Anyone know the numbers for the FF games? I think FFVII sold abour 8.6 million worldwide, but FFVIII is supposed to be the best selling FF ever.

..Graphics will improve over time. Before the PSx era, some people thought that Sonic for Genesis will the greatest game ever, graphically. And look how far we have come these days. FFVII was also mind blowing at the time.

I don't think that I would really enjoy a game with Photo-Realistic graphics. At least not for some games. Can you imagine a game like GTA with Photo-Realistic graphics and Advance AI?

[ATMA]

I'm not sure but i think FFVII sold more units than FFVIII worldwide !!
But i think that's gonna change with FFX !!
photorealistic you mean games like mortal combat and uhm was it battle gods? on the n64!!
if you mean those ...ewwwwwwwww those things are nasty ..bah keep them away from me !!!:D

[Overlord]

ATMA:
I'm not sure but i think FFVII sold more units than FFVIII worldwide !!
But i think that's gonna change with FFX !!

FFX has sold well over 5 miilion copies at this point. And is still selling pretty good in some places. It should reach over 8 miilion copies. And maybe become the best selling FF ever.

ATMA:
photorealistic you mean games like mortal combat and uhm was it battle gods? on the n64!!
if you mean those ...ewwwwwwwww those things are nasty ..bah keep them away from me !!!

Those arn't photorealistic...are they? 64 isn't that strong.

[ATMA]

It's not Photorealistic graphics but the characters were scanned in the game right?? And it kinda give it a real feeling or something

[hootie17]

i would have to say it is a complete lack of real feeling, it feels liek u r playing with cardboard cutouts.

[ATMA]

Never liked those type of graphics ..i remember that the ATARI 64 or something also had a game like that ..it was an old one!!
and you had Mortal kombat and that Battle Gods game on the N64
What a waste!!!