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DBJAY
05-14-2005, 02:09 AM
http://news.com.com/Xbox+360+demos+running+on+Macs/2100-1043_3-5706658.html?tag=nefd.top

"The nifty clips of video games supporting Microsoft's new Xbox 360 console are running on Apple machines, Microsoft confirmed on Friday.

"We purchased a number of Apple G5's because very specific hardware components of the G5 allow developers to emulate some of the technology behind future Xbox products and services," a Microsoft spokesperson said in a statement. "This is an interim development tool that will be replaced with a more powerful and comprehensive solution later."

So basically stop complaining about the visual quality of the clips, it's not even on the actual hardware yet. It is questionable judgment why they would bother showing games running on the G5 macs at "product introductions."

Reality
05-14-2005, 02:20 AM
So basically everything we seen running on the 360..wasn't really running on it? Sounds like a Sony tactic. Maybe M$ really is serious about talking their place. They are all ready taking their moves. :P Anyway, their hardware have to be done by now unless what we seen wasn't actually as completed as they wanted us to think. if not that then maybe they just don't have real development done and set off yet. Either way I'm sure Apple is loving the free promotion.

Joe Redifer
05-14-2005, 03:05 AM
Well it's certainly not shocking since all of the next generation consoles will be more Mac-based than PC-based as far as the hardware is concerned (it is better hardware after all). The 360 is pretty much just a Mac without the OS and all that jazz. I'm sure all of the development systems are G5's with a modified OS.

I just hope that when we see the games on the 360, they won't look worse than they do now, like they did when Sony finally showed their games on the PS2 instead of a tricked out PC.

Alucard
05-14-2005, 04:11 AM
Its not shocking because this happens pretty often. Most things Microsoft try to pawn off onto us are either running on the PC or an Apple system, never on its hardware. Sony's already done this when it first showed Tekken Tag. Everything was on PC. I'm basically waiting for the systems to come out so I can see it in motion because right now everything is just eye candy that doesnt exist. How we all remember Halo2 clips that claimed ingame, and then bam. Lower grade crap for real game.

Zod
05-14-2005, 10:30 AM
Once again MS swipes ideas from Mac. Not confident in Windows and PC architecture? :lol:

Mistatee
05-14-2005, 12:00 PM
Dont Worry Gates is in ENgland as we speak "Bashing Apple" according to the news
(IPOD)

DBJAY
05-14-2005, 01:12 PM
I don't think Gates is bashing apple. Doesn't he point out that in his opinion is that cell phones will replace the Ipod? It's not like he is not aware of what many third party cell phone manufacturers are doing. It's pretty likely actually that someone very shortly will merge an ipod like device with a cell phone.

But, back on subject. The G5 macs pretending to be Xbox360's will also probably happen at E3 next week. Kind of dissapointing to know that the true performance of the console and the launch will not be known until later this fall! Talk about a double edged sword. On one hand, there is potential that when the games finally are coded for the true Xbox360 (even the guy on G4 says that the games so for are on alpha kits - but it's May - game ship in 6 months) they will look considerably better (gameplay is fine btw), but that also creates an incredible time crunch for the developers, and unpolished visuals will not serve very well as an advertisement for the system over the coming months.

BashingU
05-14-2005, 01:33 PM
Well if Gears of War is not running on an Xbox360 and looks that good...Then why the hell will I be upset? Wouldn't we be blown away come fall when it looks better? It fakes out Sony and Nintendo who think that they have seen the system in totality only to be thrown for a loop....Are you really dissapointed by Ghost Recon? Get a grip, this is the best news in my oppinion...They are G5's not multi threaded machines, which the 360 happens to be...Good joby M$...2k6 still looks insane... :cool guy:

Reality
05-14-2005, 01:45 PM
I think realistically, you should be a little disappointed by not even seeing the real systems offering. For all we know, the games could look even worse come this fall. Right now, it's apparent M$ doesn't have the system done. Who knows what they might cut or add before it is. All we are seeing is games running on Mac that cost thousands, and M$ is going to do that with a system that could cost no more then $300? Showing games on everything but the real hardware is cheap and the only people who M$ is fooling are the fans. I don't speak for everyone but I myself wouldn't appreciate that.

BashingU
05-14-2005, 02:36 PM
Whats M$ been using to make their next generation games on? ummmm G5 Macs...

What have we known about over the last three months? Is that M$ plans on delivering the final ATI graphics cards to developers in the next development kit...Which will be more powerful then the current ones developers are using...This was stated by a developer who had both Xbox 360 dev kits and PS3 ones...True or False?

Where is the jedi mind trick if they tell you that this is not the system but what is capable on the system along with games that will be on the system?

I don't get the logic of pulling the wool over any gamers eyes...How come there isn't
a vague answer like "no comment" from M$?

What the hell will be wrong with them adding anything...In fact almost every website has stated that since the disclosure by M$ it conincides with information they had on the systems since last spring...don't believe me then do your reasearch and go to teamxbox who posted the specs of the system...

I'm trying to really understand the logic...

I personally want them to hold some stuff back, why the hell not? A bad bi tch doesn't have to take all her clothes off to be sexy...and M$ doesn't have to lets us know everything to be a hot with Xbox 360...

Reality
05-14-2005, 04:43 PM
I don't mean this to sound mean but if that reply is to me, it's hard to understand. It's the one sentence paragraphs. Let alone there is 4 of them. If this is a reply to me, then I'll go ahead and reply.

I personally don't really have trouble understanding why M$ would show something not running on Xbox hardware. You might not be able to (or don't want to) see the "logic" in it but they whole deal here is that, it's to fool people and get them excited. M$ did admit latter what was shown on the console was really running on Powermac computers, but only on the internet. The whole show though, was broadcasted world wide on TV. If they really wanted to be honest about it, they would have said that at the show. I think a lot of people be interested in knowing everythign they are about to see is not running on the system. But where be the hype if they admited that before showing these eye candy titles? As as right now, we still don't know what the 360 can factually do. And we wont till M$ actually starts showing games on the real system. Till then we are seeing Powermac developed titles that are meant to be Xbox2 ones.

And honestly, I don't know if the next "real" development kits they send out will be more powerful or not. Hey they could be, then again they could be buy only a few percents. I just don't know, I'm not M$ and they are the ones hacking at Apple computers. :P And I also don't know which developer your talking about. You know, the one with both Xbox360 and PS3 kits. If you going to mentioning him, mention the name or company at lest.

As for my final statement. Doing research at a site like Teamxbox be pointless right now. :P I much rather wait and see what happens in the fall then search around that place for out of date hype articles. Besides, everything at Teambox is posted here by you anyway. :P

BlindMaphisto
05-14-2005, 05:17 PM
If Microsoft honestly belives that the games they showed will be at least as good as or better than what was shown (Which I'm sure they do) then there was no reason to weight down the show with that info. Hell they didn't even say what the technical inards of the 360 was on the show so why bother with trying to explain that the games shown were running on different but slight inferier hardware? You're just bitching for the hell of it.

Reality
05-14-2005, 06:05 PM
I'm not making a deal out of it because I have nothing to do or something. I don't know what M$ will believes, but I do think if they are going to show the hardware and then the software. It should actually be on the hardware it's self.

As a gamer I want to see these things. Not another Sony copy tactic to show you something and think its on the console. Maybe other people are fine with things like that but I personally am not. I want to see for real what I'm lead to believe is real honestly. That just seems like a important little detail when it comes to buying something.

Mistatee
05-14-2005, 09:03 PM
Ps2 parts != computer parts
Hence it was hard to get exact parts for computers to develop the games that were the same as the undecided software for PS2

X360 parts == G5 parts
Hence it is possible for the developers to have a replica G5 to make an almost identical setup.

Im pretty sure that the only graphical loss will occur from MS deciding to loose certian parts to make the system more profitable. (IE a possible downgrade to 256 RAM, or drop the processors to 2.8ghz istead of 2.2, etc.)

BlindMaphisto
05-14-2005, 09:29 PM
I can't see that happening. They would loose too much face to drop specs after official announcments.

Reality
05-14-2005, 09:34 PM
I agree with that. I think 360 will be powerful, but I'm very curious on how power and for how much. I was under the impression this next gent was to not loss money like the first but G5's are big money stuff.

Alistein
05-14-2005, 10:34 PM
I'm not making a deal out of it because I have nothing to do or something. I don't know what M$ will believes, but I do think if they are going to show the hardware and then the software. It should actually be on the hardware it's self.

As a gamer I want to see these things. Not another Sony copy tactic to show you something and think its on the console. Maybe other people are fine with things like that but I personally am not. I want to see for real what I'm lead to believe is real honestly. That just seems like a important little detail when it comes to buying something.
I don't blame you but I guess this is what E3 is for also news is that Sony will also be showing a prototype at E3 and what most consoles actually show are tech demos.
Although I am anxious to see the true power of the the console too but I have often thought MS was way too early all this show was just to gain leverage and marketshare they would however be facing their rivals for the first time at E3 which is supposed to defined the final xbox build if indeed the ps3 is as powerful as said and utilizes Blue ray DVD then MS would have to step up not to be outstripped in this era as you must Know this gen is very important for MS if they fail here then it's all over which is why all necessary risks need to be taken even now there is news that Sony's GPU will be using a new lighting technology and Nvidia was in 2001 able to reproduce graphics on par with Sprits within,so as much as Sony might be trembling there is also a huge fear factor with MS not to mention producers like J.Allard and Robbie Bach might find their job spaces open if they fail like Ed Fries.
Finally all that has been happening as certainly helped MS understand what to do to improve gaming if most people push for gaming over the online and media services then MS will know they need to work more on the consoles power just like the @56 mg to 512 which was fostered by players and maybe developers.

Drunken Savior
05-14-2005, 10:43 PM
So a G5 can emulate Xbox 360? Hmmm....

BGM
05-14-2005, 11:24 PM
I don't think Gates is bashing apple. Doesn't he point out that in his opinion is that cell phones will replace the Ipod? It's not like he is not aware of what many third party cell phone manufacturers are doing. It's pretty likely actually that someone very shortly will merge an ipod like device with a cell phone.

But, back on subject. The G5 macs pretending to be Xbox360's will also probably happen at E3 next week. Kind of dissapointing to know that the true performance of the console and the launch will not be known until later this fall! Talk about a double edged sword. On one hand, there is potential that when the games finally are coded for the true Xbox360 (even the guy on G4 says that the games so for are on alpha kits - but it's May - game ship in 6 months) they will look considerably better (gameplay is fine btw), but that also creates an incredible time crunch for the developers, and unpolished visuals will not serve very well as an advertisement for the system over the coming months.
Rushed , shoddy games that are not fun or not very many games to choose from period, because of not enough time to develop for the machine will also not help matters very much either. The same thing can be said about Sony if they rush out too soon also!

phknrocket1k
05-15-2005, 12:30 AM
So a G5 can emulate Xbox 360? Hmmm....

About as well as a Pentium 3 ended up emulating an Xbox. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Reality
05-15-2005, 01:11 AM
Did they Xbox have Pentium chips in it?

Joe Redifer
05-15-2005, 04:13 AM
Yes, Xbox 1 was 733 Mhz Pentium 3.

I just downloaded the Xbox360 emulator for the Mac and a bunch of ROMs and it runs fine. Alan Wake is boring. Do not buy this.

Alucard
05-15-2005, 05:16 AM
hah! Lying as always Joe. You should know they renamed it to Jackson Pollock. Nice try.

Joe Redifer
05-15-2005, 05:54 AM
Curses! Foiled again!

BashingU
05-15-2005, 02:11 PM
Let me kill a bit ch real quick...Since I was told that I post information from TeamXbox on here anyway, I had to go to another source...Yet this information has been available for sometime...Let us know reality where the wool is being pulled over your eyes by M$...Being informed is your responsibilty...not M$...Because the information has been out for quite a while...And according to this information, for the past four-five months...



Microsoft ships first Xbox 2 development kits using Apple G5 hardware
Rob Fahey 11:06 01/03/2004

Prototype dev kits feature prominent Apple logo - who woulda' thunk it?

Although the specification for Microsoft's next-generation Xbox platform has not yet been finalised, the company has shipped early prototype development kits to some developers - using Apple PowerMac G5 systems as a basis.

Technology news site The Inquirer reported over the weekend that the software development kits (SDKs) featured dual-CPU Apple Power Mac G5 systems with ATI Radeon 9800 Pro graphics solutions - effectively making them into high end Mac systems, but running a modified version of the Windows operating system core.

The hardware configuration of the systems has been confirmed by development sources, who told us this morning that the kits are designed only for creating extremely early prototypes of game technology, with the specification of the final Xbox 2 console being radically different.

Although the final specification of the console is thought to be still under discussion at Microsoft - with issues such as the amount of RAM and the whether to include a hard drive still undecided - it's known that Xbox 2 will feature six PowerPC G5 CPU cores and a new model of the ATI Radeon graphics chipset.

As such, the current kits - which, interestingly, are actually branded with the Apple logo - are only similar to final Xbox 2 hardware in the broadest terms. Right now, neither the next-generation ATI part nor the 65nm IBM PowerPC chip - or, for that matter, the three-CPU board needed to hold them - actually exists, so Microsoft is shipping something based on current hardware in order to give developers a running start on the new platform.

The arrival of these prototype kits puts Microsoft well ahead of its rivals in the next-generation console race - since developers have yet to see specifications of Sony's PS3 and Nintendo's N5, never mind actually receiving development hardware.

The news lends weight to recent speculation within the industry that Microsoft will be the first to bring its next console to market, with a launch in autumn 2005 considered likely, while both Sony and Nintendo are thought to be aiming at 2006 launches, with a possibility of Japan-only rollouts in late 2005.




Xbox 2 SDK released on cool Apple Power Mac G5s

It comes to pass

By Paul Dutton: Saturday 28 February 2004, 15:59
WE'VE JUST got word that the Software Development Kit (SDK) for Microsoft?s forthcoming Xbox 2 has now been released to Developers.

As we reported earlier, IBM processors are indeed the Xbox 2 development platform of choice.

The big news to us is that the XBOX 2 SDK has been seeded to developers on dual Apple Power Mac G5 systems running a custom Windows NT Kernel.

The Apple Power Mac G5 is based upon two of IBM?s 64-bit Power PC processors and features ATi RADEON 9800 Pro (R350) graphics. However the R350 is believed to be an interim solution and will, in due course, be superseded by the forthcoming ATI R420.

Interestingly the SDK apparently also features an Apple logo on a side bar within the application.

What we don?t yet know is whether the custom Windows NT Kernel for the 64-bit capable IBM Power PC processors is 64-bit or 32-bit.

Though as ATI is so clearly behind with even its iAMD64 device drivers for both Intel and AMD x86-64 platforms, we suspect that it?s 32-bit.

BashingU
05-15-2005, 02:40 PM
I have a sneaky suspiscion that M$ has done such a great job at early marketing for the Xbox360 they may have forced Sony to really come out full force with info on PS3...At the same time still having a trump card in terms of not finalizing the system...We've seen games that are phenomenal "Gears of War" being one of them, and if this early software it stands to reason, that M$ wants Sony to make a move...Nice move...I strongly expect that we will see the PS3 in march people...M$ has done too good a job at getting the attention of everyone with the Xbox360...Here's further fuel for that fire...


"Welcome chang3" demands Sony, while rumours of 2005 launch spread

There are - quite literally - signs in Los Angeles this weekend that Sony plans to unveil the PlayStation 3 console at its press conference tomorrow afternoon ahead of the E3 trade show this week.

Billboards and bus posters around the city are trumpeting a message of "Welcome Chang3", with distorted versions of the famous X, square, triangle and circle buttons making for some alien sights.

US website IGN has some photos here demonstrating the effect.

There's also the suggestion that it could launch as soon as this Christmas. Sony's CFO Takao Yuhara was quoted late last week saying that "For the year end sales season, simultaneously building up both the [PSP] as well as the next generation PlayStation is one option that we have."

The "year end sales season" might reasonably be expected to refer to the months leading up to Christmas, although it's worth pointing out that Sony's financial year doesn't actually come to a close until March 2006.

The Japanese company is widely expected to lead its press conference with an unveiling of the PlayStation 3 and the gossip on the ground here is that it could be touted as much more powerful than Microsoft's rival Xbox 360, which was unveiled on Thursday night.

Sony is also expected to discuss exclusive software deals aimed at derailing the excitement over the Microsoft console.

http://ps3media.ign.com/ps3/image/article/614/614280/pre-e3-2005-playstation-3-to-change-e3-20050515044826974.jpg

http://ps3media.ign.com/ps3/image/article/614/614280/pre-e3-2005-playstation-3-to-change-e3-20050515044829755.jpg

Reality
05-15-2005, 04:14 PM
Let me kill a bit ch real quick...Since I was told that I post information from TeamXbox on here anyway, I had to go to another source...Yet this information has been available for sometime...Let us know reality where the wool is being pulled over your eyes by M$...Being informed is your responsibilty...not M$...Because the information has been out for quite a while...And according to this information, for the past four-five months...

Well those are great articles letting us know the XBox 360 is being made from Mac parts and all but um, yeah, I think we were aware of that a long time ago. So uh, I ask out of raw curiosity here, what does this have to do with M$ not showing games on the 360? After doing a TV broadcast to make you think it was? And bashing, you don't have to use the "..." all the time.

Really looking at the articles though, it doesn't tell us anything 100% factually. It states there is some things like a three-CPU board, (needed to hold 6 Powermac CPU cores) doesn't exists. We'll one would have to right now wouldn't it for the something like that to be in the 360 right?

So for now, and for me personally, all I want to know is what's in the Xbox currently and what will be in it when it's really done. We should really wait till the final hardware is out instead of reading old, hype purpose, information from anyplace. I mean hey, some of the earliest info suggested it had, what, 3-5 G5 chips in it? What we do know is that the 360 is water cooled because of the heat of the CPU, so that at lest suggest some hot power under that Apple computer of a console.

And one last thing, if you really think the Xbox 360 show did a great job in promoting the console, then that's worth a chuckle. I'd put money down that Sony had planned, designed, rented (billboards) and printed those posters before M$'s joke of a console unveiling. It's how business works. Sony would have those things out there wether M$'s show was good or not.

Alucard
05-16-2005, 12:42 AM
Welcome Change? I'd like a system from you jokers that doesnt break and actually has some freaking ram inside it you cheap bastards!!

BashingU, you need to stop going to TeamXbox. They're so full of brainwashing crap its not funny. An average game is stellar to them, and a game on PC is an Xbox game.

Alistein
05-16-2005, 11:08 AM
Well those are great articles letting us know the XBox 360 is being made from Mac parts and all but um, yeah, I think we were aware of that a long time ago. So uh, I ask out of raw curiosity here, what does this have to do with M$ not showing games on the 360? After doing a TV broadcast to make you think it was? And bashing, you don't have to use the "..." all the time.

Really looking at the articles though, it doesn't tell us anything 100% factually. It states there is some things like a three-CPU board, (needed to hold 6 Powermac CPU cores) doesn't exists. We'll one would have to right now wouldn't it for the something like that to be in the 360 right?

So for now, and for me personally, all I want to know is what's in the Xbox currently and what will be in it when it's really done. We should really wait till the final hardware is out instead of reading old, hype purpose, information from anyplace. I mean hey, some of the earliest info suggested it had, what, 3-5 G5 chips in it? What we do know is that the 360 is water cooled because of the heat of the CPU, so that at lest suggest some hot power under that Apple computer of a console.

And one last thing, if you really think the Xbox 360 show did a great job in promoting the console, then that's worth a chuckle. I'd put money down that Sony had planned, designed, rented (billboards) and printed those posters before M$'s joke of a console unveiling. It's how business works. Sony would have those things out there wether M$'s show was good or not.
Yes MS showed an incomplete system but I think they did mainly to gauge or compare what they have with their rivals it would be difficult to upgrade the system onc it's finalized, in this way they can ascertain if they have done enough to take on Sony or not if Sony comes out with a very powerful system then MS might have to upgrade certain features mayb even add a ppu chip right now MS not showing a finalized system simply means they are holding it as their ace. So let us see what happens after E3.

DBJAY
05-16-2005, 11:20 AM
This also reminds me of the original Xbox launch. I went to the whole preview thing and came away pretty unimpressed. But, by the time the system came out, several games had completely turned around (Halo), while others remained crap (Mad Dash Racing.) It will be interesting to see what happens over this week, and what software actually makes it out this fall.

Reality
05-16-2005, 01:57 PM
Yes MS showed an incomplete system but I think they did mainly to gauge or compare what they have with their rivals it would be difficult to upgrade the system onc it's finalized, in this way they can ascertain if they have done enough to take on Sony or not if Sony comes out with a very powerful system then MS might have to upgrade certain features mayb even add a ppu chip right now MS not showing a finalized system simply means they are holding it as their ace. So let us see what happens after E3.

If SOny could come out with a more powerful system the the 360, then will be pretty confused in what they are trying to achieve. They talk a lot how their console will a leap in technology where M$'s is a Xbox 1.5. Well, that 1.5 console is faster then even Apple's G5 because of it's custom designed. (According to Macworld (http://www.macworld.com/news/2005/05/13/xbox360/index.php)) G5 computers cost a lot, so I wonder what M$ is planning on loosing on this puppy. And just how much more money Sony wants to loss to make something even more.

phknrocket1k
05-16-2005, 02:44 PM
I don't necessarilly think 3 months will create a huge hard-ware difference.

Fall 2005 - Xbox 360
Spring 2006 - PS3 Japan

BashingU
05-16-2005, 04:38 PM
Reality your asking ? that just show how you have not been paying attention...Maybe you like posting oppinions just to have them...M$ has stated they went a whole new route in creating the next Xbox so that they can reduce cost on manufacturing...The chip designers are all third party companies, ATI has a better buisness model that M$ can work with, and M$ owns the entire architecture of the Xbox 360...So they can take that anywhere without having to pay anyone licensence fees...But I think you have missed all that in your rants of what you expect the system should have...It doesn't matter at the end of the day...Cool your not impressed...so what...

I mean if M$ hasn't done a good job why is Sony even putting out nonsence that they know will not materialize in the form of them releasing the PS3 early? This week we are going to see what the Xbox360 is going to have game wise, and really that's all that matters...Why would I be dissapointed if I know what they are doing because they have stated so...They didn't lie to anyone...Your just looking for something to gripe about...honestly...

Reality
05-16-2005, 06:26 PM
Reality your asking ? that just show how you have not been paying attention...Maybe you like posting oppinions just to have them...M$ has stated they went a whole new route in creating the next Xbox so that they can reduce cost on manufacturing...The chip designers are all third party companies, ATI has a better buisness model that M$ can work with, and M$ owns the entire architecture of the Xbox 360...So they can take that anywhere without having to pay anyone licensence fees...But I think you have missed all that in your rants of what you expect the system should have...It doesn't matter at the end of the day...Cool your not impressed...so what...

I'm asking "?". How do you ask a question mark? Anway!

I mean if M$ hasn't done a good job why is Sony even putting out nonsence that they know will not materialize in the form of them releasing the PS3 early? This week we are going to see what the Xbox360 is going to have game wise, and really that's all that matters...Why would I be dissapointed if I know what they are doing because they have stated so...They didn't lie to anyone...Your just looking for something to gripe about...honestly...

I'm asking "?". How do you ask a question mark? Anway!

This stuff isn't hard to figure out Bashing really, you just need to stop reading Xbox Next articles for staters. If M$ has found a way to take the hardware from something that cost thousands, and make it into something that cost only maybe $300, then I'll believe that when I see it happen. They might have found ways to do that, but that's a pretty wishful idea too. Even if they did find ways to help cut cost, it doesn't mean they wont still loss money. The only reason I brought that up anyway is because I was curious in the idea of which company is willing to spend the most money for hardware bragging. M$ is obviously not afraid to spend some money for powerful hardware. Where Sony is a company who seems like they might be spending to much given their companies current financial state. How powerful does Sony think a console has to be anyway? I think what M$ has is fine. Where they think it's hardly enough to call a next gen machine. Anyway to be honest, I'm not sure why we got to this part of the conversation.

But be honest with me here. Do you really think M$ did such a good in their MTV 360 promotion, that it "made" Sony go out and make these promotions of their own? Do you really think that? Though your welcome to have your own honest opinion about the show, I think maybe you might be missing something when everyone else seems to suggest the show wasn't worth even watching. You see Bashing in the real world, Sony knew M$ was going to have that show right? They only been hyping it for days. So they obviously knew they needed to make something to help counter hype caused by it.

Now as far as I know, Sony can't see in the future. Which would mean, they really don't have a clue if this show will be a success or not. They only know, no matter what, the need to have something out to help their hype not be over powered by this. But on your side of the world, (or on Team Xbox or where ever you get your energy from) you have this idea that the show did such a good job, that these promotions for the Ps3 are out because of that. That is just a fanboy way of thinking. :donno: The realistic reason this all happened Bashing is just how I said it before. Sony would have to plan what to do, design what to show, print what to put up, and rent places to put them for their promotion. These things would have to be done before the show, because you just don't do things like that with in hours after the show was aired. Again, Sony would have planned this move a head of time and put these things out even if M$'s show was worse then it was already. You just don't want to see it that.

And Bashing, when you show what is to be believed finished hardware, and then visually show games that are not running on it, but are there to make you think they are. Then that is a lie. A little white one maybe, but it's a lie as it's not the truth. What they did was show the 360 console and then the games to viewers. Through visuals, you being told this is what games running on the 360 look like. So when they really are not running on the 360, then that's really not being truthful about what's being shown, which would make it as much of a lie as when Sony shows things not running on the hardware. Though you might not see it like that, it is misleading. That is what bugs me. I want to see the truth, not what I'm to think is the truth and so I don't support the idea of playing little tricks like that. So while you might think I look for things to cry about, these are just little opinions of mine which turn into a big deals because you can't live with the idea that anything negativity about the Xbox is real. :crazy: You defend the green console as much as Vert did the GCN. Even with out reason.

raviadso
05-16-2005, 11:02 PM
I don't necessarilly think 3 months will create a huge hard-ware difference.

Fall 2005 - Xbox 360
Spring 2006 - PS3 Japan

Didnt make a huge diff for the DS and PSP..







oh wait.....

BashingU
05-17-2005, 02:19 AM
no I think and said the MTV special sucked...but I mean all the info that's been released and now with the knowledge that SE is making games for M$, how could they not force Sony's hand with these annoucements?...I don't where your from, but if you were Sony and billions where on the line you wouldn't be on your toes?...I can't believe the answer is no...

Reality
05-17-2005, 02:30 AM
They are one their toes Bashing, that's why the printed those posters for the M$ show for example. Not the other the other way around like you was saying before.

Zod
05-19-2005, 04:38 PM
no I think and said the MTV special sucked...but I mean all the info that's been released and now with the knowledge that SE is making games for M$, how could they not force Sony's hand with these annoucements?...I don't where your from, but if you were Sony and billions where on the line you wouldn't be on your toes?...I can't believe the answer is no...



Right now I think Sony has become so stubbornly blind to the market that no one can force their hands. If Square could, then Sony would have already taken a pretty big hint when Square started releasing games on the GC and GBA. I thinkt hat they see themslves as getting a ton of late Square releases (KH2, FF-XII, the various FF-VII spin-offs, etc) that they'll make a lot of money this year without releasing a new system, which has made them blind to the next gen that'll start without them, so in a way I see Square as holding them back long enough for the other two to gain a foothold in the next gen, for which they'll fully support.



Pics from the con showing MS running games on Macs:
http://www.anandtech.com/tradeshows/showdoc.aspx?i=2420&p=5


Kinda embarrassing for MS..................